ATTENTION: The Boards will be closed permanently on May 28th, 2014. Posting will be disabled on April 28th, 2014. More Info

Enterprise finale and JJ

Khaaan!!!!

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 72

Report this May. 18 2013, 9:46 pm

Since Enterprise's finale was depicted as a holodeck recreation that was created by Riker during the pegasus mission...Yeah, I know.....can we say that  the re-creation never took place since JJ wiped the timeline clean pre TOS therefore retroactively wiping the finale from existence? 


If thats the case I say it is worth it. I had just started to really get into that show in the 4th season when they pulled the rug out from me with that finale....and to salt the wound that is the 2nd time bacula has hit me with a bad finale that sours my taste on the whole show......anyone remember Sam meeting God in the freaking bar? I do, and if I learned nothing from Star Trek I learned that God has no need of a Starship or a Time traveling amnesiac with an imaginary sex offender for a sidekick.....Sorry. 


anyway, I know that the argument against this is that the events depicted in the Star Trek finale still happened and all that changed was the recreation never took place but could we just sort of look over this point (or say that even in the 24th century the history books dont always get it right) cand get everyone to sort of officially decanonize that finale so that it can take its place with the star wars christmas special and matrix revolutions as things that sort of happened that we cant change but we can do our best to forget...you know like that time you went on that camping trip with your creepy uncle as a kid.


let me know where you stand on this. 

Sora

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2606

Report this May. 19 2013, 4:21 pm

Wow! You mean there's another fan in existance besides me who likes These Are The Voyages?! L.A. x 2, I am your new best friend!  


 


I absolutely love the Enterprise finale and everybody wants to rip into me for it. These Are The Voyages is one of my favorite Enterprise episodes.


And to the OP, why does anything Abrams does affect anything that came before it? People prefer the term "Reboot" which is basically the nice new age politically correct way of calling it a "Remake" and that's exactly what it is, plain and simple. The original Trek timeline is complete and finished, and this new Trek, is NEW Trek. New timeline, new story. New everything. It doesn't matter what happened before or what didn't happened before. We have a clean slate with starting over.

amanda71

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2

Report this May. 19 2013, 4:30 pm

I loved it too, except for them killing off Trip. Was that part really necessary? I really wanted to see him and T'pol finally get together as an official couple. Even though that wouldn't have happened onscreen, as this was the finale, at least that could have been a future possibility in my mind. Now I know that it will never happen! Sad. But I do love Shran. The onscreen chemistry between him and Archer blow me away and I love how they love to hate each other. The show did end far too soon, though, and I was so sad it was cancelled.

Khaaan!!!!

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 72

Report this May. 19 2013, 9:26 pm

Hey I am happy that the finale made someone happy.


I personally did not like it but I would hope everyone could at least agree that putting that story in a 1 hour episode was a mistake. if paramount would not spring for a 2 hour finale then they should used the last 2 or 3 episodes to tell that story. Also, Frakes did not look good. i mean if that story supposedly happened during the last few years of next gen then what kind of messed up drug and synthahol bender was riker on that day. he looked 20 years older and 3o pounds heavier. 


having said that,,,,,I can totally get why someone would appreciate some elements of the finale. it allowed archer to found the federation and such but i just saw it as trying to do way way way more in a single episode than they should have done.


also, i always wished that more people would have died in trek. it would have provided a greater sense of peril if the audience felt that the characters were in actual danger of dying. having said that, killing trip in the last half hour of the series was just pointless. I just felt like they threw that in there for a cheap emotional pull on the audience. 


that said i think we all could agree that a fifth season would have been awesome.....supposidly had something to do with the Romulan war with the federation..........fucking paramount. 


"Ten thousand dollars for me by myself. For that you get the head, the tail, the whole damn thing."

Five Captains

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 75

Report this May. 21 2013, 6:40 pm

I liked the finale as well. I did not like the death of Trip but if you are going to kill him off it is better to do it at the end of the series than before. What I did like is how they showed that the 24th century has another hero besides Kirk. I felt the 24th century was in desparate need of more heroes and this one showed how Riker and Troi looked up to Archer and thought of him as a great man and a hero for the Federation.

Sora

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2606

Report this May. 21 2013, 11:30 pm

Wow! Fans of the Enterprise finale UNITE! This is freakin awesome! I honestly thought I was literally the only one who liked it.


And yes I will definitely agree that the finale should have been a 2 hour. TNG, DS9 and Voyager all got 2 hour finale's, and ENT got a 2 hour premiere. By that point UPN and Paramount just wanted to wash their hands of Enterprise, and they honestly didn't care anymore sadly. Because you have to think about it, Season 3 got cut short by 2 episodes, Season 4 got cut short by 4 episodes. So just counting the 4 seasons, and not the 3 full seasons we got cheated out of, but with just the 4 seasons, we got cheated out of a good 6 episodes, and then with Season 4 being 4 episodes short, there's no 5th season coming. They can't just go ahead and shell out a few extra bucks to give Enterprise a proper 2 hour finale?! I mean if they had done that, they still would have saved themselves 3 episodes out of Season 4. 1 more than Season 3. But that being said, I do fully enjoy These Are The Voyages, but I think it's extremely unfair that it was just a 1 hour. This was not only the end of Enterprise, but the end of the particular era of Trek that will go down in history as THE era of Star Trek, and the end of a non-stop 18 yesrs of Star Trek, and they just canceled the show but can't be bothered to give it a 2 hour? I mean the finale should have been a pretty big deal under the circumstances. Even a 3 hour episode since they weren't bringing the show back would have been nice and still wouldn't have cost them much in comparison to the 3 seasons of the show they cheated us out of.

stovokor2000-A

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2001

Report this May. 25 2013, 5:15 pm

Quote: Khaaan!!!! @ May. 18 2013, 9:46 pm

>

>Since Enterprise's finale was depicted as a holodeck recreation that was created by Riker during the pegasus mission...Yeah, I know.....can we say that  the re-creation never took place since JJ wiped the timeline clean pre TOS therefore retroactively wiping the finale from existence?

>


no, because the original timeliner was not wipped clean.


a new tim eline branching off the old one was created.


Photobucket

johnd777

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 1029

Report this May. 27 2013, 5:56 pm

I think you are missing the point of the alternative timeline.


All happens as it did in the original timeline. The alternatives are branches away from that timeline. Alternate realities... which (in my story line) are actually excursions in alternate universes. TNG nearly touched on the subject in the season 7 episode "Parallels."



JJ did not wipe anything out. And you make an interesting point (whether you are aware of it or not) that ST First Contact split the timeline at the Terran invention of warp drive into the new ST ENT timeline. This still did not wipe out the original timeline only split from it into another timeline.


 


 

starfan97

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 235

Report this May. 28 2013, 12:53 pm

I think since it was a holodeck program, the timeline would not be affected because its not like Riker had travelled back in time to talk to the Enterprise crew. The timeline pre TOS would still be the same. So i do not think this affects the finale. Now it may affect TNG era, which it would, but ot the hlodeck program of Enterprise signing the treaty.

JohnFourtyTwo

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 6015

Report this May. 31 2013, 4:10 am

Quote: Sora @ May. 21 2013, 11:30 pm

>Wow! Fans of the Enterprise finale UNITE! This is freakin awesome! I honestly thought I was literally the only one who liked it.


No, you're not alone out here in the Star Trek darkness. I liked it too (and there are many others) but I do have to admit it was a bit trying at times especially with all the time travel and time war themes which pretty much drove most of the non-devoted fans away which were the ones needed to keep the series going.  I do like the way Season Four was trying to tie everything together but unfortunately it was too late for this sinking ship.


"No matter where you go, there you are." - Motto from the USS Excelsior's dedication plaque and the movie "The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai Across the 8th Dimension"

Sora

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2606

Report this Jun. 18 2013, 10:28 am

Quote: JohnFourtyTwo @ May. 31 2013, 4:10 am

Quote: Sora @ May. 21 2013, 11:30 pm

>

>Wow! Fans of the Enterprise finale UNITE! This is freakin awesome! I honestly thought I was literally the only one who liked it.

No, you're not alone out here in the Star Trek darkness. I liked it too (and there are many others) but I do have to admit it was a bit trying at times especially with all the time travel and time war themes which pretty much drove most of the non-devoted fans away which were the ones needed to keep the series going.  I do like the way Season Four was trying to tie everything together but unfortunately it was too late for this sinking ship.


Yeah, you're probably right. I think if they had done maybe some of the season 4 stuff maybe in Season 2 instead, do you think it would have made much difference?


I also wish that Enterprise had been a sequel instead of a prequel. They could had the same cast, shoot even had the same ship. And nobody would have had a problem with it. Fans were upset because Enterprise was going back and re-writing Trek history and some were upset that Kirk was no longer first. If Enterprise had been a sequel, they could have still done the Xindi, and people would have probably loved it. It wouldn't have mattered that nobody had heard of the Xindi before if it had been another sequel. But oh well. We got 4 great seasons. Better than nothing I suppose.


Live Long and Prosper

Sisko the Bald

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2

Report this Jun. 19 2013, 3:53 am

What JJ Abrams did didn't affect Enterprise at all, because Nero's incursion happened about 100 years or so AFTER the events of Enterprise. That's why Scotty in Trek '09 referenced Admiral Archer's beagle, and it's why Admiral Marcus in Into Darkness had a model of Archer's Enterprise on his display case. That was Abrams' way of telling us the events of ENT are still part of this alternate reality's history.

protectorcrimson

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 1

Report this Jun. 28 2013, 2:39 pm

I remember reading somewhere that all of the events of Enterprise happen in Abrams movieverse. I achually am going back and watching all the episodes when I have time for this very reason to get a recommend watch list.  For example, I would plug in the in the mirror darkley either before or afte watching miror miror, watch these are the voyages of after watching the peguses TNG episode though I'm a little confused where it ties in. (I don't rember a refrence to the holodeck after watching it) Then the borg episode after watching first contact. That would leave the rest of the series open to watch before the movies.  


This is what I would say unless it contradicts something that is stated in the movie then it happens.  the episodes that I listed above are the only questionable canon, though first contact still might happen in this universe but thats relatvie. As well with the temporal cold war, which is a big timetravel mashup would say that happens to with this versions time agency or whatever their called.  I planning to write a blog post about this when I get the time.  

milojthatch

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 11

Report this Jul. 07 2013, 7:16 am

JJ Trek at best is a glorified fan resume for the new Star Wars film. Based on how that turned out, mission accomplished JJ!


I don't see JJ-Trek as cannon, so no, These Are The Voyages... is still cannon. I liked the episode, I just wish it had been two hours long, giving it enough time to actually tell the story right.

rob39874

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 142

Report this Jul. 08 2013, 1:11 am

Even though the Holodeck hasnt happened in the JJ timeline yet since doesnt mean that what happened with the characters in season 4 didnt happen as it was a holodeck recreation of a historic event. So Nero couldnt have wiped out Archers history only Kirks onwards but ehos to say that Future Riker has the same dilemma and uses the holodeck again to watch it

Forum Permissions

You cannot post new topics in this forum

You cannot reply to topics in this forum

You cannot delete posts in this forum