Jun. 02 2013, 10:32 pm
Quote: warp speed @ Jun. 02 2013, 6:51 pm
Quote: wissa @ Jun. 02 2013, 6:21 pm
Quote: CmdrShran @ Jun. 02 2013, 12:34 pm
>I have only one thing to say about STD The Re re Wrath of Khan.....utter CRAP!
>So many of you people here have drank the Kool Aid that Jar Jar Abrams and his cronies have provided! This "Star Trek" is devoid of anything that Gene Roddenberry set down as to what Star Trek is all about. I say this as a true old time Trekkie! I have been with Star Trek from the beginning back when TOS aired on NBC, I was one of the many who wrote in to save Star Trek after it was cancelled after its second season. I have been involved in Star Trek fandom ever since then. My last foray into saving Star Trek was when ENTERPRISE was cancelled. Now its gonna be"Deja Vu all over again" because I want to save the REAL STAR TREK. I am sad to see what has become of our beloved franchise, it has been dumbed down and Star Warsed up and in the hands of someone who has admitted that he does not and never has cared for Star Trek or its fanbase. Are all of you Trek fans blind or just desperate for something called Star Trek? Have you NOT noticed how this movie is NOT real Star Trek...dont let the little "winks" at the fans in these films fool you. Orzi and Kurtzman may know Trek but they are not showing that they UNDERSTAND Trek. Star Trek has ALWAYS been about the exploration of the Human Condition and the introspection of what makes us tick. I for the most part have nothing against the cast of the new films...they are talented and can pull this off, the problem is the story or lack thereof. Star Trek inspired people to become scientists,engineers,astronauts because of the vision that Trek gave us. Nu Trek so far has given us none of that inspiration. What we have here is eye candy dressed up as Star Trek and like most candy eventually does is rot your teeth (or in this case your mind). Don't let the Real Star Trek die....let Paramount know your feelings! Now the only place to go for real Star Trek is Star Trek New Voyages/Phase II or the new Star Trek Continues web series, Star Trek Lives there!
I don't know what the deal is with noobs showing up and posting the exact same post in more than one thread. But welcome to the boards. I'm sure everyone here who liked the movie will be glad to hear how stupid you think they are.
Your mixed statement of both welcome and insult proves your arrogance and how "stupid" (your words) you are. Everyone has a right to their opinion whether you think it's "stupid" or not.
Jun. 04 2013, 9:33 am
Quote: rocketscientist @ Jun. 04 2013, 9:07 am
>Well, I finally saw the film last night. It's the third film I've seen in the last 2 years (since my twins were born), so it was kind of special for my wife and me.
>I loved it! I thought STID was a great ST film. The actors were great, the story was well-thought out and executed, and the production looked great.
>There were so many things I loved about the film. Bruce Greenwood's scenes with Chris Pine were just great. When he tells her that "it's going to be ok, son," and Kirk's reaction to his death, well, it's just incredibly moving. Pike really was a father figure to Kirk. Clearly, over the course the last few years the two really bonded. I also LOVED seeing Nimoy again. I was hoping he'd be in STID. Yeah, it was a cameo, but it was a dang good one and served a purpose. The way Nu-Spock and Spock-Prime interacted, addressing each other as "Mr. Spock," brought a smile to my face. It sounded like they were good friends, like Nu-Spock had taken Spock-Prime up on his offer to be something of a mentor to him. That makes sense. Spock-Prime has resolved his internal human-Vulcan struggle, which Nu-Spock is still dealing with. Add on to that the trauma that both of them are still dealing with wrt the loss of Vulcan. Anyway, whoever was responsible, Orci, Kurtzmann, Abrams, thanks so much for Nimoy's appearance. I hope he's in the next one as well.
>I thought the reversed role death scene between Kirk and Spock was inspired. It's not a rip off of TWOK, if anything, it's an outright homage to that classic film. It really is the moment where the Kirk and Spock friendship begins, culminating in Spock, this time, screaming Khaaannnnn!!! (Zach Quinto did a good job, but sorry, no one will ever equal Shatner's immortal "KHAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNN!!"
>Seeing Spock lose it and go after Cumberbatch just made so much sense. Spock's emotions, which he'd been repressing so much after Vulcan was destroyed, just roared back. It made sense.
>Pine and Urban were both again great as Kirk and McCoy. This time, though, with STID, Quinto's Spock worked even better for me. I don't know what it was, last time with ST09, but for some reason, his Spock didn't work as well as Pine's Kirk or Urban's McCoy. It's probably just me and not Quinto's ST09 performance. I've thought about it a bit, and I just think that, for me at least, it was just a lot harder to seperate Nimoy, with his distinctive voice and look, from the Spock character. I don't think it had anything to do with Quinto's performance in ST09, it was my inability to make that leap for that particular character. Anyway, for whatever reason, in STID, his portrayal of Spock really clicked for me this time.
>It's interesting to see both how similar and how different Pine and Quinto's Kirk and Spock are from Shatner's and Nimoy's due to the changes in the timeline from ST09. Kirk is still not the mature commander, at least at the beginning of STID, that Shatner's Kirk was. This is mostly due to his lack of a father figure and his lack of experience as a SF officer. Shatner's Kirk always played fast and loose with the rules, including the Prime Directive, in order to do the right thing, but he also payed more attention to regulations and was more mature with his relationships than Pine's Kirk. But, again, in light of the changes in ST09, it makes sense. Pine was right in his interviews. In this film, Kirk really does become the captain of the Enterprise. He earns it.
>Similarly, Quinto's Spock is a more rigid character than Nimoy's. He's repressing a lot of emotion due to the destruction of Vulcan. He has survivor's guilt.
>I also enjoyed Pegg's Scotty. I think he's doing a good job with the character.
>Cumberbatch and Weller did a fine job as the villains of STID. Really, they both brought their A-games. Cumberbatch was definitely a force of nature as Khan and Weller did a great job as Admiral Marcus, the guy who was running Section 31.
>Story-wise, I thought the character's stories and relationships just made sense. Bob Orci, you and your fellow writers got it right.
>That said, here are my nitpicks.
>1. Once again, we have a problem wrt the time and distance. Shouldn't it be more than a day to Kronos? (loved the new Klingons ships btw, but I don't like the helmets, that's too much of a departure for me). I know the filmakers want to keep things moving, but aren't their ways to get by this? I mean, it kind of violates their premise, that this is the same galaxy as the original timeline. It should take longer.
>2. Transwarp beaming. It was used in ST09 and it's used here too. If you have transporters that can beam people across the galaxy, why do you need starships. And Khan was able to miniaturize one of them too! Yeah, they definitelyused a similar device in TNG and other deux ex machina technobabble in a lot of TNG, DS9, and VOY episodes, but sorry, this transwarp beaming thing is a real problem.
>3. Ok, this is the one that made me grit my teeth. No, no, no. The Enterprise would not just start to fall to earth, particularly at that distance, just because it lost power. I know, I have a PhD in aerospace engineering and do orbit transfer planning and design and ascent trajectories for a living (and some propulsion problems too). I have a bigger problem with this than the transwarp beaming, because this is just real physics, not magic ST technology. There was a way here to make this work, say by having a large piece of debris hit the Enterprise to change it's trajectory, or having an explosion on the ship, just something like that to impart a force on it (it'd have to be big, though). Bob Orci, do you guys have a science advisor? You had that JPL scientist, didn't you?
>4. Like a lot of fans, I'm a little dissapointed that Cumberbatch didn't bear a closer resemblance to Ricardo Montablan. Cumberbatch was excellent in the film, but after seeing how well (for the most part), the iconic ST roles were cast in the last film, I just don't understand why they didn't have him look or sound more like Montablan's Khan. On a lesser note, why the English accent for Alice Eve's Carol Marcus? Alice Eve said she could do an American accent, so why didn't Abrams have her do that? To sum it up, I was kind of bummed and left wondering why a greater effort wasn't made to get these two actors to at least sound and act like their prime-universe counterparts. '
>5. The scene in the merchant ship where Spock and Uhura discuss their relationship in front of Kirk. That just didn't work for me. It's not because of the actors or what was said, just that they'd talk it out in the presence of their commanding officer.
>6. This is more of an observation and not really much of a nitpick or a problem. Yes, I really enjoyed STID and ST09 before it, but it's hard to ignore how different it is from the previous 10 ST films in terms of action and production. Abrams' two movies had so much more money than all the prior films except for TMP (adjusted for inflation of course) and it shows. Just compare it to NEM, for instance, which had similar sfx technology available but a much lower budget. Now, I realize this is a different time, where the blockbuster films have to have these extremely intricate sfx, graphics, sfx, and action to be marketable to a younger audience that apparently has less patience and a shorter attention span. I'm really sorry if I tick any younger folks off, but the reality is with all these new phones, more elaborate video games, and how pervasive the internet is, you just can't ignore their effects on our culture. It's commented on and written about all the time.
>The problem with having all these elaborate sfx and incredible action sequences is that the character drama can be overwhelmed. That being said, I didn't think that happened in STID. I think Bob Orci, Alex Kurtzmann, and Damon Lindelof managed to keep the characters' journeys strong and simultaneously deliver what a summer blockbuster with a $190 million budget requires in terms of action and spectacle. That said, after seeing STID, I was kind of nostalic for those great TOS films, TWOK, TSFS, TVH, TUC, and even the great TNG film FC. Those films only had a small fraction of the budgets of Abrams films (adjusted for inflation). As everyone knows, all the original ST films, with the exception of TMP, had much smaller budgets than other big-budget sf action films, in particular the SW films. Because of that lower budget, imo, they had to rely more on the character drama and the story. The characters, in those better films, couldn't be overwhelmed by the sfx and the production. It was just impossible. But, by the same token, they couldn't rely on them either. The story and the actors had to make the movie great. That's something I'm appreciating more and more due to watching many classic films on TCM. There are so many really great films where the story and perfomances just shine. Like the original ST films and, especially, the original TOS series, they couldn't rely on the big action set pieces and incredible visual sfx to sell a film.
>All that said, I'm a realist. This is what a post 2010 ST film looks like now, under Paramount's current strategy. This is what they want and what they think sells, and, actually, I think they're right. It's kind of sad to say, but after the very poor box-offices of INS and NEM, both of which weren't good films imo (and the critics and most fans), it's not surprising that Paramount wants ST to look more like other summer blockbusters. I can't blame them. This is what sells nowadays.
> All that said, with things being as they are, again, I want to say again how much I enjoyed STID. I think it's a great film and I enjoyed it very much. (Bob Orci, please don't take my nitpicks and the above criticism personally, I really did love the film). I really want to see one more film, at least, with this cast and these writers. Abrams, Orci, Kurtzmann, Lindelof, and the cast and the crew should all feel very proud at creating such a great ST film.
I AM KEE-ROCK!!