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Brannon Braga calls lack of gay Star Trek characters 'a shame'

GuardianAngel1

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 21

Report this Jun. 17 2013, 4:28 pm

Quote: bunkey @ Jun. 17 2013, 3:10 pm

>So you will readily accept a fictional race of people that has four genders but you would classify a real homosexual human relationship as "wrong"?  Allllrighty then.

>Starfleet does not operate as a military faction in that sense. They allow personal relationships between crew members. That is not prohibited.  Even on TOS they had two crew members that were about to get married.  As long as it doesn't interfere with their duties, there is no problem. And how would Starfleet know what you do behind closed doors? Is there a sex police?

>This thread has really revealed how small minded and bigoted some so called fans are.


"Readily accept" no, but since this entire site is about the fandom of Star Trek, then bringing up the habits of it's creations would be allowed. As for my personal beliefs, yes, I firmly believe that homosexuality is wrong. That's the thing about living in a free country, I can believe as I like, and so can you.


Certainly they allow personal relationships, as does the military I might add, however, ST was formulated in a time of traditional famil values, and in my opinion, should stay that way. And yes, there is a sex police. Just so you know.


It has also revealed how close minded you are to traditional values. You can't expect everyone to agree with your point of view, and then use the same "close-minded bigotry" that you accuse others of having to tread on our beliefs. Either you believe in being open minded or you don't, you can't have it both ways. You're free to believe that homosexuality is acceptable, I am free to believe that it isn't. The conversation, however, is about it's role on Star Trek, and our opinions on the matter. You have mine.


"Excuse me....excuse me. I'd just like to ask a question...what does God need with a starship?" -James T. Kirk

Sora

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2606

Report this Jun. 17 2013, 5:03 pm

Quote: bunkey @ Jun. 17 2013, 2:38 pm

Quote: /view_profile/ @

>

> style="color: #6a6a6a; font-family: Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 12px; line-height: 16px;" data-mce-mark="1">My last question is, if being gay is normal, why is it that in most cases of gay couples, why is it that in both male gay couples and female gay couples, there's almost always one of them who still is the guy or the girl in the relationship, but then the other, the male couple for instance, tries to act like a woman? And in the opposite case of the female gay couple, one female acts like a man, while the other female, still acts like a female?

Oh Christ on toast, are you even serious right now?  You really believe that in most cases they're a butch/femm gender roleplay? You have been watching WAY too many movies that depict stereo types.  I can't even begin to tell you what a ridculous statement that is.  

And what makes a woman "act like a man" anyway? Because she has short hair or doesn't wear dresses or make up?  Or is it because a woman may learn how to fix the plumbing in her own home or change the oil in her car? What makes a man "act like a woman"? Because he may take care of himself and pay attention to his appearance and not burp and fart like a neanderthal?  Or is it because one partner chooses to stay home with the kids? Your gender stereotypes are outdated and ridiculous. Seriously. Oh. My. Frakkin. God. I can't even with that nonsense. 

You want gay animals? Here ya go:

http://listverse.com/2013/04/20/10-animals-that-practice-homosexuality/

There's been plenty of scientific studies of animals that mate with the opposite sex but have "relationships" of sorts with the same sex.

Just because you've "never seen a homosexual animal" doesn't mean they don't exist. By the way, how much time have you spent studying the mating habits of every animal on the planet? 

I've never seen the Grand Canyon. Must not exist then.  If that's the case, then how do you know God exists? LOL! You've never met him.  You've just disproved your own faith.

 


 


No actually, just for the record, I have known quite a few gays in my time. My childhood best friend became a woman. He got surgery and everything. He tries to act like a woman. Dresses like a woman. Wants to be a woman. And I have known quite a few lesbo's in my time too. Worked with many of them actually, and yeah in all the cases I have seen face to face, yes there is still a male and female figure at work in the relationship.


And no I can't physically prove that my God exists. But I personally do know He exists. He has spoken to me and has been a part of my whole life. I can't offer tangible evidence to prove it, but I don't need to. In the words of Kira, "That's the thing about faith, if you don't have it, you can't understand it, and if you do have it, no explanation is necessary."


I mean we can play this game all day. Your people like to say they have found fossils that prove evolution, my people also say they have found Jesus's tomb and the cloth He was wrapped in when He was dead. They've also claimed to have found pieces of Noah's Ark. They also say they found the Garden of Eden where Adam and Eve were created. I still can't go and prove they are right or wrong, and neither can you.


You continue to say that I am close minded and a bigot, yet you attack me at every opportunity, and continue to imply that I shouldn't even be allowed to enjoy Star Trek simply because I don't want gays in it. Seriously? It seems me that you are the one who is close minded and intolorant to anyone who doesn't agree with you. Because not only have you been attacking me, but you also attack anyone else who has anything to say on this matter that doesn't fit into your perfect backward view of how things are. Where is your so-called tolorance for all vews now?


Live Long and Prosper

Pooneil

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 1023

Report this Jun. 17 2013, 5:16 pm

Quote: GuardianAngel1 @ Jun. 17 2013, 3:02 pm

>

>Here's the dilemma with this train of thought. There aren't just two genders out in the ST universe, there are MANY, and within those many genders there have been numerous interspecies "encounters", which leads to the thought that the term "gay" would be obsolete in the ST universe, unless it were between a male human character and another male human character. For instance, Andorians have four sexes, two types of female and two types of male. All four are required to reproduce, so obviously that means there is male/male and female/female interaction. In addition, Starfleet is an exploration faction, but they operate like a military, and crews on ships are family. Having a relationship of that type between crew members would be just...wrong.

>I have been a Trekkie my entire life, and the reason for that is that it is a safe haven from the other ridiculous garbage on tv. I am VERY glad that there has not been openly gay and lesbian characters among the crews, as that would simply be the writers of a very good show submitting to the culturistic ideals of a small group of confused individuals.

>


Why would the writers be "submitting to the ideals of a small group"? That sounds as if Roddenberry, Braga, Moore, Gerrold, Stewart, and Mulgrew were under some kind of pressure when they made statements in favor of gay characters on their show. I'll repeat that: It's their show, not yours. If Brannon Braga or Manny Coto or whoever had gotten past the censors and studio heads and actually put a gay man on the bridge of the Enterprise, that would have been their decision, not the result of societal pressure. They woudn't be forcing anything on anyone, they'd simply be presenting you with a choice: watch it, or don't.


On the other hand, there's a small group of individuals trying to ensure that their ideals -- perhaps Christian, perhaps not -- are reflected in the show. These are the people who want the franchise to remain in the 1960s where it began. These are the confused individuals who mix up scientific theories and insist on dated butch/femme roleplaying while using derogatory terms like "lesbos".


Come to think of it, that last sentenced made me a little confused.

chator56

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 498

Report this Jun. 17 2013, 5:26 pm

Do Star Trek fans on this board realize that Roddenberry was a secular humanist? He was not Christian, or in favor of any religion. In fact, many Trek episodes attack religion in subtle ways, God is also attacked in TMP and TFF. There is only one original series episode, Bread and Circuses, that seems to be pro-Christian.

Sora

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POSTS: 2606

Report this Jun. 17 2013, 5:45 pm

Yes but it was never the Christian God that was ever attacked in Star Trek, thus I was never offended by it. In Star Trek V for instance, it was just a lifeform pretending to be God. He wasn't really God. Star Trek never disrespected Christianity in any way, and it also never disrespected gays in any way. It stayed away from both, thus nobody is offended, thus everyone can enjoy it. Why are people so intent on changing that?

Pooneil

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 1023

Report this Jun. 17 2013, 7:38 pm

Quote: Sora @ Jun. 17 2013, 5:45 pm

>

>Yes but it was never the Christian God that was ever attacked in Star Trek, thus I was never offended by it. In Star Trek V for instance, it was just a lifeform pretending to be God. He wasn't really God. Star Trek never disrespected Christianity in any way, and it also never disrespected gays in any way. It stayed away from both, thus nobody is offended, thus everyone can enjoy it. Why are people so intent on changing that?

>


Because Gene Roddenberry (i.e. the dude that invented Star Trek), David Gerrold (i.e. the dude who wrote "The Trouble with Tribbles"), Ronald D. Moore (writer of dozens of TNG and DS9 episodes as well as two ST movies), Brannon Braga (see notes re: Ronald D. Moore), Patrick Stewart (you should know who he is), and Kate Mulgrew (see previous note re: Sir Patrick), all voiced their support for the idea. If the producers and writers want to change the status quo, they should be allowed to do so. Star Trek isn't crowdsourced.

Sora

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2606

Report this Jun. 17 2013, 7:42 pm

Quote: Pooneil @ Jun. 17 2013, 7:38 pm

Quote: Sora @ Jun. 17 2013, 5:45 pm

>

>

>Yes but it was never the Christian God that was ever attacked in Star Trek, thus I was never offended by it. In Star Trek V for instance, it was just a lifeform pretending to be God. He wasn't really God. Star Trek never disrespected Christianity in any way, and it also never disrespected gays in any way. It stayed away from both, thus nobody is offended, thus everyone can enjoy it. Why are people so intent on changing that?

>

Because Gene Roddenberry (i.e. the dude that invented Star Trek), David Gerrold (i.e. the dude who wrote "The Trouble with Tribbles"), Ronald D. Moore (writer of dozens of TNG and DS9 episodes as well as two ST movies), Brannon Braga (see notes re: Ronald D. Moore), Patrick Stewart (you should know who he is), and Kate Mulgrew (see previous note re: Sir Patrick), all voiced their support for the idea. If the producers and writers want to change the status quo, they should be allowed to do so. Star Trek isn't crowdsourced.


 


Point taken, however they never actually did it. I don't know what the official reason is as to why they didn't do it though.


Live Long and Prosper

Sora

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2606

Report this Jun. 17 2013, 8:21 pm

Quote: bunkey @ Jun. 17 2013, 2:38 pm

> 

>I've never seen the Grand Canyon. Must not exist then.  If that's the case, then how do you know God exists? LOL! You've never met him.  You've just disproved your own faith. 

>


And in your words and attitude towards me, your own intolorance as it were, you have inherently fulfulled the scripture.


Matthew Chapter 10 verse 22, Jesus says "You will be hated by everyone because of me, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved." John Chapter 15 verse 8, Jesus says "If the world hates you, remember that it hated me first."


So I guess I can't be too shocked that you have all but made your hate towards me very clear. You are of the world, and this is pretty clear that the world will hate me for speaking the truth because the truth is a threat to you. You'll notice that other religions are not attacked nearly as often or as harshly as Christianity. This world belongs to Satan and follows Satan, whether you believe that or not is irrelevant. Whether anyone here wants to believe that or not is irrelevant. The bottom line is it's the truth. Deal with it....


Live Long and Prosper

Pooneil

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 1023

Report this Jun. 17 2013, 8:29 pm

Quote: Sora @ Jun. 17 2013, 7:42 pm

Quote: Pooneil @ Jun. 17 2013, 7:38 pm

Quote: Sora @ Jun. 17 2013, 5:45 pm

>

>

>

>Yes but it was never the Christian God that was ever attacked in Star Trek, thus I was never offended by it. In Star Trek V for instance, it was just a lifeform pretending to be God. He wasn't really God. Star Trek never disrespected Christianity in any way, and it also never disrespected gays in any way. It stayed away from both, thus nobody is offended, thus everyone can enjoy it. Why are people so intent on changing that?

>

Because Gene Roddenberry (i.e. the dude that invented Star Trek), David Gerrold (i.e. the dude who wrote "The Trouble with Tribbles"), Ronald D. Moore (writer of dozens of TNG and DS9 episodes as well as two ST movies), Brannon Braga (see notes re: Ronald D. Moore), Patrick Stewart (you should know who he is), and Kate Mulgrew (see previous note re: Sir Patrick), all voiced their support for the idea. If the producers and writers want to change the status quo, they should be allowed to do so. Star Trek isn't crowdsourced.

 

Point taken, however they never actually did it. I don't know what the official reason is as to why they didn't do it though.


There are studios and networks concerned with ratings -- the same anonymous boogeymen who didn't want to see an alien or a black woman on the original Enterprise.


If that doesn't work, it has always been convenient to blame Rick Berman.


Everyone has always been reticent in their interviews, often placing the blame on mysterious forces who shall remain nebulous...perhaps the Illuminati, or the Mafia, or the Teamsters, or some such powerful organization. If you ask me, I think it's probably some number-cruncher concerned with demographics. In the early or mid Nineties, more people would have turned away from Star Trek if gay characters had shown up. In 2013, that's less likely. It will bother some people -- and some fans will be lost -- but it wouldn't make such a big splash that the executives would notice.


As some guy once sang, the times they are a-changing.

Admiral Jimmy

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 21

Report this Jun. 17 2013, 10:20 pm

just because youve never seen something dosent mean its not there i think quntam phisycs is mostly acurate except for example it says if there is a fire but no one sees it then there was in fact no fire WRONG! God is up there the evidence is all around us

Admiral Jimmy

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POSTS: 21

Report this Jun. 17 2013, 10:22 pm

if gays show up in Star Trek they will lose my being its fan

Sora

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2606

Report this Jun. 17 2013, 10:23 pm

Quote: Admiral Jimmy @ Jun. 17 2013, 10:20 pm

>

>just because youve never seen something dosent mean its not there i think quntam phisycs is mostly acurate except for example it says if there is a fire but no one sees it then there was in fact no fire WRONG! God is up there the evidence is all around us

>


Thank you, Admiral Jimmy


Live Long and Prosper

Admiral Jimmy

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POSTS: 21

Report this Jun. 17 2013, 10:34 pm

your welcome sora your awsome 

Sora

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2606

Report this Jun. 17 2013, 10:51 pm

Quote: Admiral Jimmy @ Jun. 17 2013, 10:34 pm

>

>your welcome sora your awsome 

>


Thanks I appreciate it. I'm glad that someone actually listened to what I had to say and took it to heart.


Live Long and Prosper

Admiral Jimmy

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POSTS: 21

Report this Jun. 17 2013, 11:06 pm

hey sora are you on Facebook or something?

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