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Why do Zealous Fan Boys Wish for Failure?

DS9_FOREVER!

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Report this May. 08 2013, 6:01 am

Quote: Vger23 @ May. 06 2013, 8:18 pm

>Also it's not exactly fear of change. The change has happened. We're living it and have been since May 2009. It's more like failure to accept change and deep resentment that the narrow vision THEY have of Star Trek is gone and will not return.


 


Sounds like those that didn't support Enterprise.


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Vger23

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Report this May. 08 2013, 11:27 am

Quote: Utopia Planetia @ May. 07 2013, 8:50 pm

>

>Persecuting me? Hahah, more internet nonsense.

Crusade, behavior, hate. These are internet comments about a movie. If anyone of any opinion thinks any of this warrants the level of hand-wringing and attention you and others give to it, some perspective is in order. I'd start with a long, leisurely walk.

>Finally, I see that you all want to discuss a phenomenon you've all noticed and that interests each of you. So I won't disturb by interjecting my differing positions any further. Happy theorizing and good luck.

>


 


I don't even know what point you're trying to make here. Maybe my reading comprehension is to blame. I don't know.


So, YOU come into a thread, make two completely off-topic and non-productive posts that are defensive in nature, and you're blaming participants of this thread for losing prespective and needing to calm down?


What am I missing here?


Nobody attacked you. Nobody said that not liking these or any other films was unacceptable. There IS, however, a discussion about people who take it personally and spiral down into negativity and shameful behavior. Are you one of these people and therefore had a nerve rubbed wrong by this...or are you just missing the point (I ask for the 2nd time)?



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Vger23

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Report this May. 08 2013, 11:37 am

Quote: DS9_FOREVER! @ May. 08 2013, 6:01 am

Quote: Vger23 @ May. 06 2013, 8:18 pm

>

>Also it's not exactly fear of change. The change has happened. We're living it and have been since May 2009. It's more like failure to accept change and deep resentment that the narrow vision THEY have of Star Trek is gone and will not return.

 

Sounds like those that didn't support Enterprise.


 


 


Not exactly.


There were people who "didn't support Enterprise" because they flat out didn't really like it. There's nothing wrong with that. I can't say I liked it very much either to be frank. So, why tune in every week to something that doesn't entertain you? I'd give it a shot because I'm a Trek fan. I'd watch 6-8 episodes per season, just to make sure I'm not being ridiculous...but I wasn't going to carry the "Enterprise" flag if it didn't do anything for me. I suspect others feel the same about many other various elements of the franchise.


But, then there were the people who openly attacked Enterprise and bad-mouthed it and argued to death about how it sucked at every available opportunity. That's a completely different story, and is more like what we're talking about here. So, to further the "Enterprise" example and relate it to me personally...just because I didn't like ENT much...I wasn't out there bitching and complaining about it and calling for people's heads and it's death. It's still part of the franchise I love, and there are fans who DID/DO like it very much. Why would I want to be part of tearing that down?? Just because I personally don't like it? That's not a good reason and is extremely selfish, entitled behavior.


Nobody should have to like something they don't particularly connect with. But, taking it to the next level (which is what this post that AtoZ started here is all about) is the embarassment.


They are both very different and very seperate things. One is perfectly normal, especially in a 47-year old franchise with 100's and 100's of hours of entertainment to pick and choose from. The other is the behavior of insecure, entitled droolmonkeys.


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wissa

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Report this May. 08 2013, 12:18 pm

Quote: Vger23 @ May. 08 2013, 11:37 am

Quote: DS9_FOREVER! @ May. 08 2013, 6:01 am

Quote: Vger23 @ May. 06 2013, 8:18 pm

>

>

>Also it's not exactly fear of change. The change has happened. We're living it and have been since May 2009. It's more like failure to accept change and deep resentment that the narrow vision THEY have of Star Trek is gone and will not return.

 

Sounds like those that didn't support Enterprise.

 

 

Not exactly.

There were people who "didn't support Enterprise" because they flat out didn't really like it. There's nothing wrong with that. I can't say I liked it very much either to be frank. So, why tune in every week to something that doesn't entertain you? I'd give it a shot because I'm a Trek fan. I'd watch 6-8 episodes per season, just to make sure I'm not being ridiculous...but I wasn't going to carry the "Enterprise" flag if it didn't do anything for me. I suspect others feel the same about many other various elements of the franchise.

But, then there were the people who openly attacked Enterprise and bad-mouthed it and argued to death about how it sucked at every available opportunity. That's a completely different story, and is more like what we're talking about here. So, to further the "Enterprise" example and relate it to me personally...just because I didn't like ENT much...I wasn't out there bitching and complaining about it and calling for people's heads and it's death. It's still part of the franchise I love, and there are fans who DID/DO like it very much. Why would I want to be part of tearing that down?? Just because I personally don't like it? That's not a good reason and is extremely selfish, entitled behavior.

Nobody should have to like something they don't particularly connect with. But, taking it to the next level (which is what this post that AtoZ started here is all about) is the embarassment.

They are both very different and very seperate things. One is perfectly normal, especially in a 47-year old franchise with 100's and 100's of hours of entertainment to pick and choose from. The other is the behavior of insecure, entitled droolmonkeys.


Yeah, I can't stand Voyager.  Hardly ever do you see me in the voyager forum picking it apart and ranting about plot holes.  That would be crazy.  What do I care if other people like it?   that, and to do so I'd have to watch it. 


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DS9_FOREVER!

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Report this May. 08 2013, 12:56 pm

Quote: Vger23 @ May. 08 2013, 11:37 am

Quote: DS9_FOREVER! @ May. 08 2013, 6:01 am

Quote: Vger23 @ May. 06 2013, 8:18 pm

>

>

>Also it's not exactly fear of change. The change has happened. We're living it and have been since May 2009. It's more like failure to accept change and deep resentment that the narrow vision THEY have of Star Trek is gone and will not return.

 

Sounds like those that didn't support Enterprise.

 

 

Not exactly.

There were people who "didn't support Enterprise" because they flat out didn't really like it. There's nothing wrong with that. I can't say I liked it very much either to be frank. So, why tune in every week to something that doesn't entertain you? I'd give it a shot because I'm a Trek fan. I'd watch 6-8 episodes per season, just to make sure I'm not being ridiculous...but I wasn't going to carry the "Enterprise" flag if it didn't do anything for me. I suspect others feel the same about many other various elements of the franchise.

But, then there were the people who openly attacked Enterprise and bad-mouthed it and argued to death about how it sucked at every available opportunity. That's a completely different story, and is more like what we're talking about here. So, to further the "Enterprise" example and relate it to me personally...just because I didn't like ENT much...I wasn't out there bitching and complaining about it and calling for people's heads and it's death. It's still part of the franchise I love, and there are fans who DID/DO like it very much. Why would I want to be part of tearing that down?? Just because I personally don't like it? That's not a good reason and is extremely selfish, entitled behavior.

Nobody should have to like something they don't particularly connect with. But, taking it to the next level (which is what this post that AtoZ started here is all about) is the embarassment.

They are both very different and very seperate things. One is perfectly normal, especially in a 47-year old franchise with 100's and 100's of hours of entertainment to pick and choose from. The other is the behavior of insecure, entitled droolmonkeys.


 


My point you alluded to in your second paragraph.


Many that scorned it had the preconceived notions on how it had to be. When it wasn't that, they ripped it apart.


Very narrow vision.


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bunkey

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POSTS: 686

Report this May. 08 2013, 3:19 pm

The original pilot "The Cage" was rejected by NBC as "too cerebral".


Thank gods JJ Abrams has solved that problem.


Sarcasm is my native language.
JJ Abrams is not of the body.

Gawain_VIII

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Report this May. 08 2013, 3:32 pm

Quote: bunkey @ May. 08 2013, 3:19 pm

>

>The original pilot "The Cage" was rejected by NBC as "too cerebral".

>Thank gods JJ Abrams has solved that problem.

>


Probably the most profound statement on these forums.


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Commanding Officer, Frontier Fleet
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Treknoir

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POSTS: 1784

Report this May. 09 2013, 9:50 am

Seriously, folks.


Stop making arguments no one made.


I personally don't care for ENT or VOY. Heck, I don't even like Riker.


But I'm not gonna take a repeated dump on those who DO like what I don't like.


It's not enough to say, I didn't care for X because Y.


Overzealous fan boys have to take it to the EXTREME. JJ is da debil. It breaks canon (when canon is a fuzzy concept and classic ST is far from continuous and non-contradictory). They hope the films fail. The characters would NEVER do X (um, they don't effing exist, no one's feelings are hurt). This is traumatic and soul crushing. Let's vote on the sucktacity of the new films. The ship is wrong (I don't care how many damn catalogs and limited edition blueprints there are, the ship is fictional). JJ probably murders puppies and curses on Sunday and should be stripped of his humanity. It violates the Great Bird's vision (LOL, what?).


They don't ever just state their valid opinion and move on. They must, MUST, make JJ pay and the 3000th post on his utter awfulness will SURELY hurt his feelings and make the lost ones see the light and return to the prime fold. Amen.


 


It is curious how often you humans manage to obtain that which you do not want. - Spock

Vger23

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POSTS: 6799

Report this May. 09 2013, 10:29 am

[quote]


[quote]


The original pilot "The Cage" was rejected by NBC as "too cerebral".


Thank gods JJ Abrams has solved that problem.


[/quote]


Probably the most profound statement on these forums.


[/quote]


No, becuase it's ill-informed. Roddenberry "solved the problem" by making a more entertaining and accessible script titled "Where No Man Has Gone Before" which contained fun, spectacle, drama, action and adventure. The new movies have simply gone back to that formula. So, JJ was simply doing what was done all the way back in 1966...sell a fun, entertaining product that people will enjoy and relate to.


 


And , for that he deserves a ton of credit. Even Roddenberry, who was as stubborn and egotistical as they get, knew that you had to make something people would ultimately enjoy. The Trek films of the past 10 years got away from that. These have gotten back to it in a huge way. Kudos to Bob, Alex and JJ for following that model.


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darmokattanagra

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POSTS: 386

Report this May. 09 2013, 11:27 am

God forbid anyone ruin it for vengeful TOS fans who are just happy to have THEIR Star Trek back.




Seriously though, does anyone honestly believe the future of the franchise depends on universal acceptance of this "new" direction? Does it really surprise anyone that people who didn't like the first movie are hoping for failure and calling for boycotts of Into Darkness considering so many who liked the movie have made such a big deal about "financial success?"


Are these "worship" threads any better or less absurd than the "hate" threads?

bunkey

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Report this May. 09 2013, 1:42 pm

My problem is that I have specific issues with the reboot that cause me not to like it.  They're very rational but because I'm not blindly supporting this, it makes me a "hater" or not a true Trekkie. The fact that I want  Paramount to stop producing subpar Star Trek is unimaginable to people.  The fact that I'd rather wait another 20 years and hope for a better product to return to TV than consume just anything labeled Star Trek means I am not a true fan.  


I'm actually working on a rather long post for my own blog about it, which addresses certain issues such as casting, whitewashing, the loss of what I feel are fundamental Star Trek values and what Star Trek means to me.  I'll be sharing it here and elsewhere but I'm sure that no matter how well thought out my argument is, I will be called a hater, old fashioned, narrow minded, etc.

darmokattanagra

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Report this May. 09 2013, 5:44 pm

What bothers me most is not that the Abrams movies are bad movies or even that they are bad Star Trek movies, it's that people are accussing others who don't like this "new" direction of being "afraid of change." Would I have preferred another TNG movie? Yeah. Would I have preferred Enterprise stayed on the air? Yeah. But what I really would have preferred is if the "nuTrek" we got was actually new and not just a reimagining of TOS. I mean, I don't hate TOS nor am I a TOS purist but I am not going to "carry the flag" for Abrams simply because he made a sh!tload of money for TPTB.

Blockman

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Report this May. 09 2013, 6:12 pm

lol. nerds will be nerds

It's been funny watching both fanwanky zealous sides defend each of their positions for over 4 years now, like it's somehow going to change something about either side, or like all this complaining is somehow new to Trek.

You're judged by the effort you expend bickering against the opposite side. Shows how much you truly care/how worth-it you consider their argument to be.


darmokattanagra

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POSTS: 386

Report this May. 09 2013, 6:46 pm

I don't think my opinion is going to change anything but I'm not going to stay silent while I am generalized and labeled a "toddler," a "loser" or an "entitled droolmonkey." Especially by those who clearly have their own "entitled, narrow-minded" view of what Star Trek is or should be.


Also, if all you're going to do is ride the fence and laugh at "nerds" and "fanwanky zealots" then why bother throwing your two cents in at all? Just sit back and enjoy the show.


 


P.S. One of the CAPTCHA words for this post is "Zealot."


Blockman

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Report this May. 09 2013, 7:11 pm

Quote: darmokattanagra @ May. 09 2013, 9:46 pm


"I don't think my opinion is going to change anything but I'm not going to stay silent while I am generalized and labeled a "toddler," a "loser" or an "entitled droolmonkey." Especially by those who clearly have their own "entitled, narrow-minded" view of what Star Trek is or should be.


Also, if all you're going to do is ride the fence and laugh at "nerds" and "fanwanky zealots" then why bother throwing your two cents in at all? Just sit back and enjoy the show."
--------------


I have thrown in my 2 cents, long ago. Not much sense in repeating it everytime, and at such lengths.


Trust me, as I said before, I have been enjoying it, which is why I only have 500 posts in 4 years from watching, rather than multiple 1000's from engaging all the time...


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