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Just watched STV

leroybrock

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 213

Report this Feb. 26 2013, 7:35 am

Just because Sybok *says* that he's not trying to control or brainwash people doesn't mean that he's not doing exactly that. A character/person may even believe what they say about themselves and their behavior because people deceive themselves all the time. Sometimes the more intelligent someone is the easier it is for them to lie to themselves.

Also I believe that the movie did not clearly present the crew as having committed mutiny willingly. Each affected crew member appeared to be in a very obviously altered state of mind.

My claim that Kirk doesn't save the day still stands. The character does not succeed in any way through the course of the movie except by staying alive. Everyone else, even Sybok, saves the day

As for McCoy I think DeForest Kelly did a wonderful job. I might have a different perspective on that scene since I had to make the same kind of decision. Spock's "pain" wasn't even really pain. The scene indicates that Sybok thought that he was drawing up something painful to Spock and failed. More evidence that Sybok was practicing self deception about what he was doing to people.

I Am Ultra Narcissus.

leroybrock

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 213

Report this Feb. 26 2013, 7:37 am

Also, I'm not going to try and argue what Shatner's intentions are known to have been or suspected to be. It's done and only the finished product concerns us now.

I Am Ultra Narcissus.

2takesfrakes

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 3682

Report this Feb. 26 2013, 4:31 pm

Bottom line:


This movie sucks because Shatner got his hands on it.


It is a view of life as “The Shat” sees it. Viewing it on its "merits,"
it was even set up, clumsily. Its entire premise DEPENDS on The
ENTERPRISE being screwed up. Sybok's mission to obtain a starship
totally relies on this and he gets handed one on a platter, because it's
just "in the script." Sybok also seems shocked that Spock is onboard.


So, there's ANOTHER insane coincidence we have to accept. Then, finally,
this idea of GOD waiting and presenting himself in such a lame fashion.
Sybok's about to wet himself, though, he's so happy and only Kirk has
the wits to even question this situation, even before Spock (!!!).


The lamest aspect is the revelation that Klingons REVERE Kirk as the
ULTIMATE warrior! This was NEVER the case before and nothing in the
movie series even justified taking this position. The jokes and all of
the physical comedy fall flat.


It's almost as if the filmmakers had never watched the show, before.


 


leroybrock

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 213

Report this Feb. 26 2013, 5:10 pm

Those are also not valid criticisms unless you're going to hold every other Star Trek movie to the same standards.

Clumsy Setup
-Nemesis: Where do you even start with this one? Picard to be replaced with a much younger clone of himself (very convincing), slave finds ultra-rare Soongian Android and leaves it scattered around a desert and is detected by the Enterprise who knows how far away and a slave class constructing a shipyard / incredibly advanced & huge warship under the nose of all Romulans & the Tal Shiar? Yeah right.

-STVI: Klingons build a warship that can fire and fight while cloaked. Apparently they forget how to do this immediately after the movie ends.

-STII: Nobody is puzzled that the system they're in is missing a planet and the one they think they're going to is in a wildly different orbit. The captain beams down alone with Tchekov, unarmed and unescorted into a hostile environment. Tchekov totally forgets that he was involved in marooning a genetically engineered warlord in this very spot.

Insurrection: Data being around to watch over the immortal hippies in the first place because walking around a primitive village was more important than working on the Enterprise.

God
-No it wasn't really God. Clearly.

Klingons impressed by Kirk
-In STIII the man blew up his own ship to kill a small number of Klingons, fought their insane captain on a dying planet, stole their ship and then proceeded to use it as his personal time-travelling whale-chariot in the next film.

There's a lot of Klingons and it's not unreasonable that more than one of them read the report and said "Holy Flaming Targ-Balls, that's amazing!"

The real bottom line is that you just seem to have something against Shatner. Relax and heal, dude.

I Am Ultra Narcissus.

2takesfrakes

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 3682

Report this Feb. 26 2013, 6:53 pm

I understand that you identify with Bones'
pain in this story. That's cool. However ...
I'm not trying to convince you, or anyone,
to NOT to like this movie. BUT ...


You asked that I not apply my knowledge of
Shat's intentions to my observations. Now,
I'm getting these comparissons to the lazy
writing in other TREK movies, this time.


Your whole argument and default position is to
find the "good" in STAR TREK V, by finding fault
with every other STAR TREK movie. While mine is:
the direction of this movie was incompetent
and that's The Director's fault. As I recall ...
the credits name William Shatner as the director.


This movie's pap. Kitsch. And I've already
spelled out plenty of reasons why, previously.
It's, quite simply, not good entertainment.


leroybrock

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 213

Report this Feb. 26 2013, 7:00 pm

I'm not trying to make the movie good by making the others bad. I'm saying that if you're willing to forgive some pretty massive faults or just ignore the faults in the other movies then you should be able to forgive some in this one as well.

I Am Ultra Narcissus.

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