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When do you think warp drives will be possible?

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Created by: Dagoth

Zondii

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POSTS: 2

Report this Jan. 22 2013, 9:25 pm

FTL or 'warp speeds' could possibly be achieved, but the issue remains on whether our fragile, squishy bodies would survive the experience. A way would have to be devised to completely (and, might I say, instantly!) negate all inertial forces being placed on our bodies during acceleration/deceleration processes. Even at a measly 6G, ie. 6 times the force of Gravity, most humans are bordering on loss of consciousness due to our inability to push the blood to our brains under such a gravity load. Our bodies simply weren't designed for it. The G-forces that would be generated to make FTL a viablility, and even the minutest delay in the 'inertial compensators' would render us a thin red paste on the back wall of any starship with FTL technology. I would love to see it, personally, but it's a long, long way off yet.


 

NCC-1873

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POSTS: 27

Report this Jan. 23 2013, 2:05 am

I remember as a young kid in the 80's telling my dad we were going to have flying cars pretty soon. he laughed and said he was told that when he was 6 in 1959. 2013 still waiting... and were still using gas no less. I hate to be cynical but less than 200 yrs is unrealistic... sure our technology has improved but only for monetary gains. Until we eliminate money; warp drive or even manned operations out of our orbit will sit on the back burner with present day politics.

Mitchz95

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Report this Jan. 23 2013, 6:09 am

Quote: NCC-1873 @ Jan. 23 2013, 2:05 am

>

>I remember as a young kid in the 80's telling my dad we were going to have flying cars pretty soon. he laughed and said he was told that when he was 6 in 1959. 2013 still waiting... and were still using gas no less. I hate to be cynical but less than 200 yrs is unrealistic... sure our technology has improved but only for monetary gains. Until we eliminate money; warp drive or even manned operations out of our orbit will sit on the back burner with present day politics.

>


If Cold Fusion works out, we may not be using gasoline for much longer.


"The future is in the hands of those who explore... And from all the beauty they discover while crossing perpetually receding frontiers, they develop for nature and for humankind an infinite love." - Jacques Yves Cousteau

Dagoth

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POSTS: 18

Report this Jan. 25 2013, 5:45 am

Your idea revolves around a process where the experiment is controlled to suite your own idea.


 


If the same ball that you are using did not have a string attached to it then the ball would simply be flu


Interesting read, despite being long.


http://scifi-real.com/ - sci-fi ideas becoming reality

dryson

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POSTS: 749

Report this Feb. 02 2013, 11:15 am

To understand the theory behind warp drive some notions of Einstein must be...unthought.


The first notion is that space can be warped. Space cannot be warped because space is not a particle, wavlength or photon. Space can defined as the nothing of nothing. This means that space cannot and will not effect upon another particle or be effected upon by another particle an energetic reaction.


Particles, wavelengths and photons however can be warped.


In order for a warping to occur a particle must effect another particle and effect on other particles an energetic effect as a cause of their properties creating such an enegetic result based upon the particle, wavelength or photon coming into contact with another particle, wavelength or photon.


Space does not have any of these energetic properties so can therefore not be warped.


This means there is a process that creates the velocity of lightspeed. A process of energetic combinations that occur in space that if such a process of velocity were not obtainable then the process itself would be just like space. Non existant and without the ability to create the process of lightspeed through the combination of particles, wavelengths which result in a photonic release of energy.


The trick is adding mass to a light photon only for a Planck so that it will create a thrust velocity potential of light speed or close to light speed.


Space is the infinite fishbowl in which energetic reactions occur.


A bullfrog with a light in its belly is nothing more than a glutton looking to shine otherwise.

Sehlat123

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Report this Feb. 04 2013, 10:59 am

Quote: dryson @ Feb. 02 2013, 11:15 am

>

>The first notion is that space can be warped. Space cannot be warped because space is not a particle, wavlength or photon. Space can defined as the nothing of nothing. This means that space cannot and will not effect upon another particle or be effected upon by another particle an energetic reaction.

>


Nasa says the idea is plausible...


"Borg. Sounds Swedish."

Sehlat123

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Report this Feb. 04 2013, 11:02 am

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lD08CuUi_Ek


It's kind of depressing, but whatever.

Shirou Goenji

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Report this Feb. 06 2013, 1:34 pm

The NASA is working in the Warp Drive. That´s a good sign, i hope.

dryson

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Report this Feb. 08 2013, 12:02 pm

If any of you have been reading my posts sorry about the typo's. Sometimes my mind gets going so fast that words and thoughts jump to the next orbital.


I have defined space as nothing. Not having the ability to affect or be affected by energetic reactions of any type or state of matter.


....but there is another state of matter that can also be described as space. That state of matter is Dark Matter.


Dark Matter is the matter particle in the anti-space/space realm. We know that space is nothing and does not react with or against energetic particles, wavelengths or photons.


Dark Matter on the other hand is space because it occupies a measureable volume within anti-space. Anti-Space is the area between space (Dark Matter). Although space is very difficult to detect we know that it exists because of various experiments that have been conducted that prove that Dark Matter exists and causes some interactions between particles that would otherwise not occur within normal space. Normal Space is space where particles can be combined together through artificial means or natural means where the result can be studied with and input and output result either yield a 0 or a 1 or a No or a Yes or the light is on or the light is off.


So basically we have three layers of space thus far:


Anti-Space - A totally non energetic realm where particles, wavelengths and photons do not create or effect upon the space itself because such a space is not a particle, wavelength or photon.


Space - Space is Dark Matter because we know it exists based upon unusual interactions between Dark Matter particles, wavelengths and photons that have not yet been verified but still exist. This would suggest that Space does in fact have energetic properties that can effect upon particles, wavelengths and photons within Space. Since Space can effect upon energetic matter within Space then Space itself can also be effected upon by the energetic paticles that Space, Dark Matter, effects. Basically anytime that one particle or state of matter effects another particle or state of matter even though one state of matter or particle is very hard to detect but is detectable then such a state of matter or particle regardless of its elusiveness can be effected upon.


Normal Space - Space where particles, wavelengths and photons and energetic reactions can be created naturally or artificially with predictable, measurable and applicable results.


 


Since Space, Dark Matter, can effect particles Space can therefore be effected upon. This means that somewhere within Dark Matter interactions with particles, wavelengths and photons creates the fast as light velocities of a light photon along with keeping and maintaining the half life of energetic reactions within A-Space.


After doing a little bit of research on the Higgs-Boson there are particles that actually attach theirselves to particles passing through the Boson Field that then creates the particle mass when in the presence of a gravitational field.


http://science.howstuffworks.com/higgs-boson.htm


Basically the Higgs-Boson effects a particle in much the same way that colander works.


http://www.bedbathandbeyond.com/product.asp?sku=11508006&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&gclid=CMaCpoe2p7UCFY-iPAod6CQA0g


As a particle passes through a gravitational field the electrons act as the hard surface of the colander within the atom. The more holes that are present means that more water can flow through the colander. In this case the water will represent gravity and Space where the surface will represent the electrons of the atom and the holes theirselves will represent A-Space.


The more holes present means water will pass through the colander at faster rate.


But heres the kicker. If a colander has 100 holes in it that are .125" in diameter would the water travel faster through the colander while the colander is raised skywards at a velocity of 5 mph compared to the same collander with 50 holes in it that are .250" in diameter that is raised skywards at a velocity of 5 mph?


Even though the first colander has more holes in it the distance between each hole is greater in the second colander meaning that the flow rate of water in the second colander will be greater because there is less surface area present which allows the water to flow at faster rate compared to more surface area being present with the first colander even though there are more holes for the water to flow through.


Basically a light photon since it does not occupy A-Space,Space and Normal Space all at once, which means that it would an infinite velocity and would occupy all space and points in space at once is in fact effected by Dark Matter or Space because its takes a light photon x amount years, minutes and seconds to reach its destination.


This means that a light photon does in fact have a energetic property that is effected by Space which in fact limits the light photon to velocity of light speed as well as creating the very process of light speed.


If this wasn't true then light would occupy all space-time all the time allowing humans to see all of the suns in the Universe that emit photons even though such a sun would be on the other side of the Universe.


If a light photon was not effected by Space, Dark Matter, then we would also be able to see the light emitted from a neighboring Universe that could be no more than a few hundred billion kilometers on the outside of our Universe.


This means that a light photon cannot exist in A-Space because there is not any Space, Dark Matter, to effect an enegertic reaction upon it nor would the light photon be able to effect an engertic reaction upon Space as well.


Both forces in opposition and attraction to each other creates the velocity of light speed.


Since there is not any energetic reactions within A-Space the trick to achieving light speed velocities and faster is too create a field around a ship using the particle of the Higgs-Boson that attract to a particle to give the particle mass or its weight within a gravitational field where such particles would render all particles mass less and without energetic reactions that would place an extreme amount of weight upon the ship as it traveled faster and faster and occupied more space.


In the real of the Universe and its causalities there are processes that attract and repel each other.


With the Higgs-Boson the process is the same. If there is an interaction within the Higgs-Boson that causes particles to be given mass then there is a particle that would also have the tendency to repel the same particle that actually gives a particle its mass as the particle passes through the Higgs-Boson.


As the particles in space pass through the Boson they would have the particles that create their mass stripped away only for a Planck where the Space Matrix Restoration Cowl would then introduce the particle that gives the particles their mass back into the particle.


This process would create possibly create A-Space where because there is no gravity present or any energetic reactions at all save for the interal dampening field that would hold the ship together, the mass of the combined weight of the particles would not build upon the ship thus creating a wall of particles that would combine with the paritcles of the ships metalic alloys that would then cause the metallic alloys to become a different particle altogether because of the extreme rate of velocity at which the interactions occured at.


Basically A-Space would be created around the ship allowing the ship to exceed the faster then light speed barrier because there would not be nearly the amount of particle mass present that would otherwise slow the ship down because of the increased need of fuel to overcome the increase of stellar mass.


The key to FTL is finding the particle within the Higgs-Boson that would repel the particles that lend mass to other particles rendering them without mass or weight.


This must be true for the simple fact that like all the causalities within Space the only notion that exists is there is a lending of energy and a taking away of energy that would exist within the Higgs-Boson because if such a causality was not present then the Higgs-Boson would be A-Space.


Just like Spock told Scotty. "Space is the thing that is moving." Space being Dark Matter and not Anti-Space and the Higgs-Boson are the keys to FTL.


FTL is possible.


If FTL or FAL (Fast as Light) wasn't an achievable velocity then humans would not exist.


Bounces the ball back to God...What you got old man.


A bullfrog with a light in its belly is nothing more than a glutton looking to shine otherwise.

dryson

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Report this Feb. 14 2013, 1:34 pm

To clarify my thoughts about the Higgs-Boson particle.


Basically since there are always two opposing forces just like matter an anti-matter and since a Progenitor Particle adds mass to particle within the Higgs-Boson, there would also be a particle within the Higgs-Boson that would have the ability to reduce the number of Progenitor Partricles of the Higgs-Boson that would reduce the mass of each particle passing through the Higgs-Boson field.


So somewhere out there in space there is an Anti-Higgs Boson that functions the opposite of the Higgs-Boson where it would take away the Progenitor Particles thus reducing the mass of each particle.


The Anti-Higgs Boson would be the particle that would create a field around a ship that would reduce the atoms in space of their mass thus reducing the amount of weight placed upon a ship traveling close to FTL and faster velocities.


There is always a positive particle value and a negative particle value to every particle in space otherwise humanity would not exist.


Matter and Anti-matter is the base of the thought for this idea because without one another existance would not be.


A bullfrog with a light in its belly is nothing more than a glutton looking to shine otherwise.

facilitator

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Report this Feb. 15 2013, 8:43 pm

The reason I believe a "Warp Drive" will never be feasable is because I belive a greater propulsion system will be developed and that is based on the most powerful yet benign force in the universe: Gravity.   Crating a focused artificial mass that will basically pull rather than forcibly propel.

Mitchz95

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Report this Feb. 15 2013, 9:52 pm

Quote: facilitator @ Feb. 15 2013, 8:43 pm

>

>The reason I believe a "Warp Drive" will never be feasable is because I belive a greater propulsion system will be developed and that is based on the most powerful yet benign force in the universe: Gravity.   Crating a focused artificial mass that will basically pull rather than forcibly propel.

>


I would think that creating a gravity well strong enough to pull a ship faster than the speed of light would be pretty dangerous.


"The future is in the hands of those who explore... And from all the beauty they discover while crossing perpetually receding frontiers, they develop for nature and for humankind an infinite love." - Jacques Yves Cousteau

Gawain_VIII

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Report this Feb. 20 2013, 1:49 pm

Quote: dryson @ Feb. 02 2013, 11:15 am

>To understand the theory behind warp drive some notions of Einstein must be...unthought.


Not necessarily.  There are actually two different, but complimentary theories on relativity, both promulgated by Einstein.


In 1905, the Special Theory of Relativity (or Special Relativity) is what everyone thinks of with E=MC^2 and that as speeds approach the speed of light the energy required to obtain that speed approaches infinity--making FTL impossible; and, if you were somehow able to do it, you would travel back in time and would not catch up to the "present" until the amount of time it would take light to travel the same distance has elapsed.


However, in 1916, Einstein expanded on, and provided an exeption to, Special Relativity with his General Theory of Relativity (or General Relativity).


General Relativity generalises SR and Newton's Law of Universal Gravitation, providing a unified description of gravity as a geometric property of spacetime. In particular, the curvature of spacetime is directly related to the energy and momentum of whatever matter and radiation are present.


Or, in simpler explanation:  Space and Time are linked together, gravity affects both in the exact same manner.  In a "blank canvas" of spacetime, without the outside influence of matter (causing gravity) or energy (causing radiation) then SR is absolute and involiolate--FTL is impossible.


Add matter and energy into the mix, then they change the way spacetime behaves--they bend the shape of the fabric of space (the space-time continuum, to use familiar Trek-ish terms).  THIS is the "loophole" which allows for the possibility of the Alcubierre (warp) drive.


Using the model of the Alcubierre drive, the object (a vessel) is NOT travelling FTL--it's travelling at conventional speeds (if it's moving at all), but the gravitational waves (warp field) that the drive causes will WARP the shape of the space & time around the object--moving the section of space, at FTL speeds, to a new location.


The most interesting part of this is that, because inside the warp field, space-time remains flat and constant, there is no time dilation which Special Relativity tells is should be there.  So a ten-day journey will take the same ten-days for the ship as it does for both the origin and destination equally without experiencing any kind of time-warp or travel.


As far as the OP's question goes: My answer is "it depends on the political climate of the planet.  If things remain relatively unchanged it will take to the end of the century, however if there were some stimuli which prompted a new "space race," we can be standing at the gates of ShiKahr by the end of next decade.


ROBERT CHARLES GRAHAM, Vice Admiral
U.S.S Gawain NCC-91980
Commanding Officer, Frontier Fleet
sto-frontier-fleet.proboards.com

Gawain_VIII

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Report this Feb. 20 2013, 1:53 pm

Quote: facilitator @ Feb. 15 2013, 8:43 pm

>

>The reason I believe a "Warp Drive" will never be feasable is because I belive a greater propulsion system will be developed and that is based on the most powerful yet benign force in the universe: Gravity.   Crating a focused artificial mass that will basically pull rather than forcibly propel.

>


That's basically that an Alcubierre (Warp) drive does--create a massive artificial gravitational force (mass) which changes the shape of the space around the ship.


ROBERT CHARLES GRAHAM, Vice Admiral
U.S.S Gawain NCC-91980
Commanding Officer, Frontier Fleet
sto-frontier-fleet.proboards.com

Ensign Moran

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Report this Feb. 23 2013, 2:36 pm

I'm optimistic about it being done by the end of the centuary. I love Star Trek, but something I do have to criticise is its timeline. It would be optimistic to the point of foolishness to say that we would have warp drive by the 2060s, and still unlikely to say there will be humans on Mars by the time Star Trek Voyager said they would be there (I believe 2032).


 


So will a bit of luck it'll be by the end of the centuary!


We are the Borg. You will be assimilated. Resistance is futile.

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