FleetAdmiral_BamBam GROUP: Members POSTS: 44386  |
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Oct. 22 2012, 7:26 pm
Quote: padracin @ Oct. 22 2012, 3:50 pm | Quote: FleetAdmiral_BamBam @ Oct. 22 2012, 10:23 am | Quote: padracin @ Oct. 17 2012, 3:47 pm | >
>celtic, later christianized, even later transformed in the US, and of course, observed by neo-pagans. the original holiday - Samhain - was the Celtic |
How has halloween been "christianized"??
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As Christianity was beginning to spread beyond the region of the mediterranean the Pope encouraged missionaries to adopt local pagan customs that the populace held in affection. Thus Samhain, a time when Celts felt the veil between this life and the afterlife became thin, became the eve of All Hallows (Halloween). The Celtic New Year was changed into the Feast of All Saints (All Hallows). The date of Christmas was selected to be close to the winter solstice; Imbolc (Feb 1) became St. Brigid's feast, May 1 (Beltane) started a month dedicated to the Blessed Mother etc.
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I'm familiar with merging Christmas and Winter Solstice.... and I'm also familliar with All Saints Day..... but that's not a merge with Halloween. To many (not all) Christian churches, Halloween is a very anti-Church / anti-God day celebrating the demonic, not the Godly.
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padracin GROUP: Members POSTS: 325  |
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Oct. 23 2012, 4:28 pm
Bam:
All Saints and All Hallows are the same thing, and its a holy day of obligation in the Catholic Church, which made a deliberate effort to 'co-opt' the esteemed practices of people they wanted to convert. There is no demon in the Celtic pantheon - that concept is part of western theology - Jewish/Christian/Muslim. My ancestors, and perhaps yours, worshipped God this way. I respect them, and my God was never offended by them. |
OtakuJo GROUP: Members POSTS: 16220  |
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Oct. 23 2012, 9:02 pm
I'm not sure that many people would accuse the early church of correctly interpreting pantheistic religions.
Have you ever danced with a Tribble in the pale moonlight?
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juliansgirl7 GROUP: Members POSTS: 40548 |
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Oct. 24 2012, 8:29 am
my kids have never been able to wear costumes to school. Too many safety issues with capes on the playground.
Edna Mode was right-No Capes!
"Your quality will be known among your enemies before ever you meet them, my friend"-Alexander Siddig in Kingdom of Heaven
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trekhed68 GROUP: Members POSTS: 1579 |
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Oct. 24 2012, 9:01 am
"Those who would sacrifice essential Liberty in order to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." -- Benjamin Franklin
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FleetAdmiral_BamBam GROUP: Members POSTS: 44386 |
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Oct. 24 2012, 9:19 am
Quote: padracin @ Oct. 23 2012, 4:28 pm | >
>Bam:
>
>All Saints and All Hallows are the same thing, and its a holy day of obligation in the Catholic Church, which made a deliberate effort to 'co-opt' the esteemed practices of people they wanted to convert. There is no demon in the Celtic pantheon - that concept is part of western theology - Jewish/Christian/Muslim. My ancestors, and perhaps yours, worshipped God this way. I respect them, and my God was never offended by them.
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Everything I see when I research this shows that they are not the same thing - only placed near each other (like Christmas and winter soltice.)
I guess I look at it with regards to the goal of the holiday. Halloween and All Saints have different goals and objectives.
And if we get down to a personal level, it really depends on one's views about certain holidays. For example, I always have to laugh at people who celebrate Christmas while rejecting Christ Himself (and I have no delusions that Jesus was born on 25 December.)
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padracin GROUP: Members POSTS: 325 |
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Oct. 24 2012, 2:37 pm
Quote: OtakuJo @ Oct. 23 2012, 9:02 pm | >
>I'm not sure that many people would accuse the early church of correctly interpreting pantheistic religions.
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Well OtakuJo it would depend on which time period we mean when we say early church and where in the world the church was. But specifically the first four centuries of Christianity in the British Isles which is sometimes referred to as the Celtic Church, I suspect held on to their world view and embraced a new level of enlightenment on top. It was indigenous and not very closely directed by Rome until the Council of Whitby, and held many native practices for centuries afterward.
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