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Enterprise being canceled seems like a double standard to me.

Sora

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POSTS: 2606

Report this Jun. 20 2012, 8:43 pm

For whatever reason, and I have no idea why, Star Trek alledgedly has millions and millions of fans, yet every series has stuggled for high ratings. I don't think any Star Trek series has had high ratings. Yes TNG did have the highest ratings of any Trek show, but I still don't think TNG had ratings as high other tv series.


DS9 struggled for ratings and Paramount would not let them have an 8th season. Voyager struggled for ratings and I know they considered canceling Voyager, now I'm not sure what kept Paramount and UPN from canceling it. But i've heard when Season 7 began, a possible 8th season was out of the the question. But still 7 seasons is a respectable run for any series.


So why is that Enterprise could not have been allowed to have 7 seasons?


I mean DS9 and Voyager and Enterprise all felt to me like they were designed and intended to have had 7 seasons.


It just seems to me that Enterprise's cancelation was out of hate and spite. It's no secret UPN hated Enterprise, and I think Paramount liked it even less, which is really retarded since Rick Berman told Paramount they needed to wait for a few years after Voyager before doing another series, and they wouldn't listen to him. It just seemed like they wanted to do everything they could to make Enterprise fail. Especially with cutting Season 3 short by 2 episodes and Season 4 short by 4 episodes.


It's not fair, if DS9 and Voyager could struggle but still be allowed 7 seasons and be allowed to finish, why was Enterprise denied the very thing given to the other series?


I get that some fans really didn't like Enterprise. But guess what alot of fans didn't like DS9, and alot of fans didn't like Voyager. Alot of fans did like DS9 and Voyager. You can't please everyone. It just seems like a major double standard.


Thoughts? Opinions?


 

stovokor2000-A

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POSTS: 2001

Report this Jun. 20 2012, 8:57 pm

Quote: Sora @ Jun. 20 2012, 8:43 pm

>DS9 struggled for ratings and Paramount would not let them have an 8th season.Voyager struggled for ratings and I know they considered canceling Voyager, now I'm not sure what kept Paramount and UPN from canceling it. But i've heard when Season 7 began, a possible 8th season was out of the the question.


Dude, they never wanted a 8th season.DS9 was planned to be 7 seasons from the start.


Same thing goes for Voyager.They planned on 7 seasons from the start, not 8.


Enterprise just wasnt as popular with the fans at the time.


 


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Sora

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Report this Jun. 20 2012, 9:23 pm

I just read somewhere online that there was talk of an 8th season for both DS9 and Voyager. But it wasn't neccessarily a definite thing. Just bouncing off ideas, and that the idea was very quickly struck down by the networks.


But I've heard your story more than the other. So I guess I'm more inclined to go with yours. But I know DS9 and Voyager both had to try and get their ratings up. I know that was part of why Worf joined DS9 and why Seven of Nine joined Voyager. Enterprise isn't my favorite series, but it's still Trek, I still love it. I really think it deserved 7 seasons. I assume it too was planned for 7 seasons at the start of Season 1?


 


You're saying Enterprise wasn't popular with fans at the time would indicate that Enterprise is popular now? I would like to think so. It really was good. I mean I know most people say that they were just getting burned out and needed a break and it didn't appeal to them right away and then after a few years they watched it and said wow this is really good stuff.


Live Long and Prosper

Reedworftripparis

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Report this Jun. 20 2012, 9:29 pm

I have said it before that I think ENT wasn't as successful because it was Trek overload. Most poeple didn't watch ENT because Trek was in your face for just about 15 years when it debuted. I didn't like it at first (it is now my favorite in the franchise) because I didn't like them going back in time. I thought it should be set in the current Trek era or sometime after.'


When I sat and watched it there is no denying that I loved it and the characters. It was well written for the most part and the acting was excellent. The development of them were on target and there was an ease to liking them. 


Had it gone a 5th season, it would have lasted to a 7th imo because season 5 would have been the Romulan War.


I miss it dearly and I think they could revive it with enough interest and knowing that the actors are in ENT uniform shape. 


"Reed Alert, that's not bad"...Malcolm Reed

Sora

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POSTS: 2606

Report this Jun. 20 2012, 9:41 pm

Quote: Reedworftripparis @ Jun. 20 2012, 9:29 pm

>

>I have said it before that I think ENT wasn't as successful because it was Trek overload. Most poeple didn't watch ENT because Trek was in your face for just about 15 years when it debuted. I didn't like it at first (it is now my favorite in the franchise) because I didn't like them going back in time. I thought it should be set in the current Trek era or sometime after.'

>When I sat and watched it there is no denying that I loved it and the characters. It was well written for the most part and the acting was excellent. The development of them were on target and there was an ease to liking them. 

>Had it gone a 5th season, it would have lasted to a 7th imo because season 5 would have been the Romulan War.

>I miss it dearly and I think they could revive it with enough interest and knowing that the actors are in ENT uniform shape. 

>


 


Well I feel the same way you, I hated Enterprise when it first aired. Now let me point out, I was also an immature kid when it aired. I was 12 in 2001 when it aired. I was just getting into TNG and learning more about DS9 and Voyager, and I had no interest in TOS at that age. But I was totally OCD about Trek already and it bugged me that it went back in time. I thought if they wanted to go back in time they should make it authentic and go out of their way to make it appear like Enterprise aired in the early 60's or late 50's. Which obviously would've been retarded, but I was 12. When I got older I started craving more Trek, and realized hey I have another 2 series I haven't touched. So that's when I got into TOS and ENT. Now ENT isn't my favorite series, but I really love it. I just love DS9 and Voyager and TNG so much that they all still pass ENT for me, but I still say now that ENT is brilliant!


I really wish there was some way to bring it back for 3 seasons to complete everything. But the show ended 7 years ago, it would be completely unheard of for them to come and bring ENT back now. I think between 2006 and 2008 it probably would've worked. But 7 years later in post 2009 Abrams Trek era, I just don't see it ever happening.


Live Long and Prosper

Reedworftripparis

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Report this Jun. 20 2012, 9:52 pm

I don't either. I wish it would because the plans for the Romulan War is just mouth watering to me. The thought of seeing it on screen. It's deliciious to think about. I have read the books about it and they were good but to see it on tv and adding things differently, I feel cheated. 


Shran was suppose to be a regular character which is a shame we didn't see that. 


The could have beens 


"Reed Alert, that's not bad"...Malcolm Reed

Hugues

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Report this Jun. 20 2012, 10:49 pm

Actually ENT would fit perfectly in the post 2009 Abrams Trek era, as it happened before. And yes, we got cheated out of 3 years of fantastic Trek.


DS9 RULES!!!!!

stovokor2000-A

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POSTS: 2001

Report this Jun. 21 2012, 12:15 am

Quote: Sora @ Jun. 20 2012, 9:23 pm

>

>I just read somewhere online that there was talk of an 8th season for both DS9 and Voyager. But it wasn't neccessarily a definite thing. Just bouncing off ideas, and that the idea was very quickly struck down by the networks.


Then I suggest that what you read was complete bull$hit..........at least when it comes to DS9.


DS9 was a "SYNDICATED" show,syndicated shows air on different netweorks in different markets.For example DS9 ran on a local owned station in NYC known as WPIX, while in Las Veges it ran on the local Fox network.


Which means no 1 network had any say on how it was produced or how long it ran.


But you are right, both DS9 and Voyager struggled to keep their ratings up, its the nature of Sci/Fi shows. I'm sure they hoped for 7 seasons, I know they had planns for season 5.


And yes, I am saying Enterprise wasn't popular with fans at the time, which hurt the series.


But many of those same fans that claimed not to like the show durring its run have come to love the show in more recent years.


 


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Sora

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Report this Jun. 21 2012, 7:33 am

Quote: stovokor2000-A @ Jun. 21 2012, 12:15 am

Quote: Sora @ Jun. 20 2012, 9:23 pm

>

>

>I just read somewhere online that there was talk of an 8th season for both DS9 and Voyager. But it wasn't neccessarily a definite thing. Just bouncing off ideas, and that the idea was very quickly struck down by the networks.

Then I suggest that what you read was complete bull$hit..........at least when it comes to DS9.

DS9 was a "SYNDICATED" show,syndicated shows air on different netweorks in different markets.For example DS9 ran on a local owned station in NYC known as WPIX, while in Las Veges it ran on the local Fox network.

Which means no 1 network had any say on how it was produced or how long it ran.

But you are right, both DS9 and Voyager struggled to keep their ratings up, its the nature of Sci/Fi shows. I'm sure they hoped for 7 seasons, I know they had planns for season 5.

And yes, I am saying Enterprise wasn't popular with fans at the time, which hurt the series.

But many of those same fans that claimed not to like the show durring its run have come to love the show in more recent years.

 


 


I wonder why Voyager and Enterprise couldn't become syndicated as well then? I mean TNG and DS9 both were right? Why was it that Voyager and Enterprise HAD to stay on UPN?


And that is good that people have warmed up to Enterprise. I do remember when startrek.com did a poll asking what the most underated series was, I think it was a landslide for Enterprise.


It sort of reminds me of TOS, because TOS also had bad ratings and was canceled for the same reason Enterprise was, but then later on became popular. Now I know Enterprise will never be mainstream popular. Only within the fan groups, however I attribute that to when TOS was around, there just simply was not as much to do in the entertainment world. It's possible that if TOS had been around in today's era, I think it would've been forgotten. Because today with all of our cell phones and computer's and video games, iPads, iPods and instant download streaming, a million channels to pick from, and a ridiculous amount of tv shows available to buy and new ones being made all the time.


In the time of TOS, I may be wrong, but I believe there was only what 3 channels available at that time? No dvds, no VHS, no internet, re-runs of TOS on one of those 3 channels nearly every night with nothing else to do, compared to the other available tv series of that time period? It's really no shock TOS became popular under those circumstances.


Kinda makes me want to do it again so Enterprise can become popular like TOS and maybe we'll get some movies or something


Live Long and Prosper

wissa

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POSTS: 4023

Report this Jun. 21 2012, 9:39 am

upn didn't exist when tng and ds9 were created. 


 


Paramount started their own network and Voyager was one of the big draws for it.  Banking on the success of tng. 


however, upn didn't have the coverage that the syndicated shows got becuase they weren't in all markets.


 


but on a side note, a show being on the air is kinda a fickle thing.  Sometimes a show will last longer than it should for reasons that have nothing to do with ratings.  Like, it being a favourite of a high ranking person in the company, the networks commitment to a certain type of programming, or other factors that we may not know about.  I think enterprise was really the victim of too much sci fi competition and lack of access to a lot of markets.  During it's run people were complaining about not being able to get upn or of it being preempted by basketball. 


 


I also think it failed to hold it's audience the first half of season one.  The numbers for the premier were huge.  But dropped off quickly. 


I also think Enterprise was a victim of circumstance to some degree.  The premiere was delayed because of 9/11.  A lot of people were not that interested in tv for a while and perhaps were not interested in seeing a more vulnerable side to star trek


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Sora

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Report this Jun. 24 2012, 6:49 pm

Yeah that's a good point. Within the next 6 months after 9/11 tv, particularly scifi tv was the last thing on everyone's mind after such a tragedy like that. Plus who knows how many trekkies were in those buildings when the towel heads flew planes into them?

stovokor2000-A

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POSTS: 2001

Report this Jun. 24 2012, 7:13 pm

Quote: wissa @ Jun. 21 2012, 9:39 am

> I also think Enterprise was a victim of circumstance to some degree.  The premiere was delayed because of 9/11.  A lot of people were not that interested in tv for a while and perhaps were not interested in seeing a more vulnerable side to star trek

>


Sorry but you are in error.


Enterprise may have suffered from a lost of interest due to 911, but its premiere was not delayed because of those events.


There were adds for the show dating as far back as Augest for the shows premiere on September 26th.


 


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stovokor2000-A

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Report this Jun. 24 2012, 7:17 pm

Quote: Sora @ Jun. 24 2012, 6:49 pm

>

>Yeah that's a good point. Within the next 6 months after 9/11 tv, particularly scifi tv was the last thing on everyone's mind after such a tragedy like that. Plus who knows how many trekkies were in those buildings when the towel heads flew planes into them?

>


really??


you should keep those type of comments to yourself.


 


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wissa

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Report this Jun. 24 2012, 10:07 pm

Quote: stovokor2000-A @ Jun. 24 2012, 7:13 pm

Quote: wissa @ Jun. 21 2012, 9:39 am

>

> I also think Enterprise was a victim of circumstance to some degree.  The premiere was delayed because of 9/11.  A lot of people were not that interested in tv for a while and perhaps were not interested in seeing a more vulnerable side to star trek

>

Sorry but you are in error.

Enterprise may have suffered from a lost of interest due to 911, but its premiere was not delayed because of those events.

There were adds for the show dating as far back as Augest for the shows premiere on September 26th.

 


that's not the way I remember it. 


 


but even so, that doesn't discount the rest of my post


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stovokor2000-A

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POSTS: 2001

Report this Jun. 24 2012, 10:14 pm

Quote: wissa @ Jun. 24 2012, 10:07 pm

Quote: stovokor2000-A @ Jun. 24 2012, 7:13 pm

Quote: wissa @ Jun. 21 2012, 9:39 am

>

>

> I also think Enterprise was a victim of circumstance to some degree.  The premiere was delayed because of 9/11.  A lot of people were not that interested in tv for a while and perhaps were not interested in seeing a more vulnerable side to star trek

>

Sorry but you are in error.

Enterprise may have suffered from a lost of interest due to 911, but its premiere was not delayed because of those events.

There were adds for the show dating as far back as Augest for the shows premiere on September 26th.

 

that's not the way I remember it. 

 

but even so, that doesn't discount the rest of my post

then I suggest you remember it wrong.


Heres the promo that started airing in late spring/early summer of 01


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_fnMidQ6CGk


 


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