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Has this occured to anyone else?

kree8or

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POSTS: 43

Report this May. 27 2012, 2:23 am

Just watching the first episode of Voyager and something occured to me. Couldnt they have placed explosives on a timer on the array? That way they could have used the array to get back to the alpha quadrant and also destroy the array, thus saving the Ocampa? win-win


 


RStar17

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POSTS: 382

Report this May. 27 2012, 9:49 am

The self-destruct was damaged during the battle with the Kazon. The Kazon were pretty much already beaten after Chakotay kamikazied the big ship. The two little ones, at least one of which was damaged, were no threat to Voyager. Voyager had demonstrated time and again, they could defeat three of those ships no problem. The actual episode itself even had the Kazon captain, clearly angry about the Array being destroyed and vowing revenge, just leave. So clearly they had enough.


The problem with this was just poor wriiting. It wasn't enough to strand them in the Delta Quadrant, but they wanted Janeway to make a moral decision. But they bungle it so badly it just makes her look stupid instead.


FleetAdmiral_BamBam

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Report this May. 27 2012, 11:18 am

I think they had to ensure that the array was destroyed.  Time delay and go means that they couldn't be sure.

RStar17

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Report this May. 27 2012, 1:58 pm

If a fuse or a timer, both of which we've had in OUR time for generations, aren't considered reliable enough and Janeway is so self-righteous, then have someone stay behind and hit the detonate button.


Even Miss Obvious Counselor Troi figured out sometimes you have to order someone to their death. Or if Janeway is so self-righteous, as this scene is trying to potray her as, stay hit the button herself.


As the events were presented in the episode it was quite possible for them to destroy the array and use it to get home.


A few lines changed could alter the situation to trap them. The collision damages the array. The sudden apperance of a dozen Kazon ships coming. But then it wouldn't be the "noble" (meaningless) sacrifice to save the Ocampa... despite Janeway's previous rhetoric about children having to grow up.


GottaloveB'elanna

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Report this Jun. 02 2012, 1:10 pm

Well, maybe they were just in a hurry?! The Caretaker himself was already dead and they didn't know how the array worked. Then the Kazon were really close and their back-up teams was coming. Just to say, when the array was blown up they warped out of there as fast as they could. Thereby were they with a small crew, at this point Chakotay didn't join yet. With such a jump they may noy even have made it. But I really think they portrait Janeway quite well, She couldn't have recisted the Kazon if they went back...

kree8or

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POSTS: 43

Report this Jun. 02 2012, 2:11 pm

How long would it have taken to beam a couple of Photon torpedos on to the array? If they could manage to do it to a borg ship, they could do it with the time restraints they had with the array. Also concerning the Kazon, surely changing the balance of power in the delta quadrant would be going against the prime directive. If they got back to the alpha quadrant, their "footprint" would have been minimal.

RStar17

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POSTS: 382

Report this Jun. 02 2012, 3:08 pm

Quote: GottaloveB'elanna @ Jun. 02 2012, 1:10 pm

>

>Well, maybe they were just in a hurry?! The Caretaker himself was already dead and they didn't know how the array worked. Then the Kazon were really close and their back-up teams was coming. Just to say, when the array was blown up they warped out of there as fast as they could. Thereby were they with a small crew, at this point Chakotay didn't join yet. With such a jump they may noy even have made it. But I really think they portrait Janeway quite well, She couldn't have recisted the Kazon if they went back...

>


Not really, the Kazon retreated the instant Janeway destroyed the array despite how angry their captain was. He vowed revenge. That he left meant he didn't have any backup nearby or he clearly would have continued the fight.


Janeway specificly ordered Tuvok earlier in the episode to figure out how the array works and how to use it. Tuvok said he was ready to use it right before the fight.


So time really isn't an issue considering the bad guys could be, in fact pretty much already were, beaten off and Tuvok could use the array.


The problem was just in the writing of the episode. They wanted Janeway to make a "moral" decision to stay behind willingly. Stranding the crew wasn't enough, they artifically tried to inject some self-righteousness into the scenario and just... failed. As they presented the episode, they could have very easily left their tricobalt warheads with a timer attached to detonate after Tuvok used the Array, which he specificly made a point to learn how to use earlier in the episode, to get home.


Anime Odo

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Report this Jun. 02 2012, 7:41 pm

Maybe the triculbolt divice could not be turned to a "timer mode"


"I don't believe in luck, but I appreciate the sentiment." - Odo

RStar17

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POSTS: 382

Report this Jun. 02 2012, 8:06 pm

Then it's less advanced than weapons we use today. We've had timers for over a century, we've had fuses even longer.


In Dark Frontier they beamed over a photon torpedo with a timer to explode. So they had everything they needed to destroy it and get home.


Beershark

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POSTS: 2590

Report this Jun. 04 2012, 8:23 pm

Well if they had done that it would have been a one episode series, now wouldn't it?


CORPORATIONS AREN'T PEOPLE! Soylent Green is people.

RStar17

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POSTS: 382

Report this Jun. 04 2012, 10:54 pm

Or just a series with better writing that they would proofread the script for rather blatant mistakes like that.


You could have had that Kazon captain board the array while they were dealing with the big ship then tempt Janeway with the offer of let them have the array and they'll send her home.


Janeway gets her moral choice by blowing up the array and there isn't a hole in the script big enough to fly Voyager through.


Beershark

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Report this Jun. 05 2012, 11:22 pm

But the OP as them going back to the alpha quadrent, thus bringing the series to a VERY early finale.


That was my point.


CORPORATIONS AREN'T PEOPLE! Soylent Green is people.

Voyager2374

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POSTS: 9

Report this Jun. 12 2012, 8:03 pm

They could of but then the kazon could of disarm it after they had left plus i dont think there would of been enough time to activate as they would have been pulled away and there was a chance that it would of never worked captain janeway could not take that chance


Captain Amy Of the U.S.S. Star Trek

RStar17

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POSTS: 382

Report this Jun. 12 2012, 9:42 pm

They had all the time they wanted. The Kazon were already beaten as I said earlier in the thread. Even the Kazon captain knew he couldn't take on Voyager.


Yes, there is the possibility they could board the array after it sent Voyager home. It's not mathematicly zero, but it's close. One would assume the off switch or the equivilent thereof would be encrypted. Most explosives are also rigged to blow up if someone starts tinkering with it, in an attempt to disarm it. Let's face it, the Kazon aren't savvy enough to be breaking encryption codes or disarming a warhead they had never seen before in minutes. They can't even get their own water. 


So it's really not much a chance. I know people want to defend Janeway and her "moral choice" but thanks to the writing, this was one of her more stupid moments. As I said before, a few lines saying the Kazon had overwhelming reinforcements closing. or the Kazon boarding the array before they used it, would have made much more sense. Janeway gets to show how self-righteous she is without looking incompetent by blowing the array then.


Voyager2374

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POSTS: 9

Report this Jun. 12 2012, 10:34 pm

I think that is one of the bravest disions that Janeway ever made and for the sake of the new series at the time there was no other way to write it with out making it a movie and then moving on to the next idea in the star trek timeline. And i also think that say if kirk was in her shoes that he would of never had the courage to do what she did for a planet that she had no business getting involved with its called the prime directive she is one of the best captains and her show was way better then all the rest and nothing should ever have been different those writers were genious


Captain Amy Of the U.S.S. Star Trek

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