Star Trek

Life style sure,would you call being born a slave in the early 1700's a life style that is a choice? It's the same argument here. And really it's a matter of, being able to love the person you want; in the ways that are sacred and meaningful to you. It shouldn't be anyone else's decision. Imagine if it were you and your loved one. Now imagine that because that person is not what everyone else approves of for you, you are denied rights and formalities, most of the rest enjoy.

I was in the ER with my fiance' a year ago, he was going into cardiac arrest, about ever 20 minutes or so for around 13 hours-before this all began he made it clear he wanted me to stay with him while he was there. Then sometime after that I began to cry, and it was irritating his sister- who in turn threatened to have me removed, and could not have made that threat had I shared his last name. All I could imagine was not being there and fulfilling what very well could have been his last request of me. Love is something that is ALWAYS worth fighting for. 

Life style sure,would you call being born a slave in the early 1700's a life style that is a choice? It's the same argument here. And really it's a matter of, being able to love the person you want; in the ways that are sacred and meaningful to you. It shouldn't be anyone else's decision. Imagine if it were you and your loved one. Now imagine that because that person is not what everyone else approves of for you, you are denied rights and formalities, most of the rest enjoy.

I was in the ER with my fiance' a year ago, he was going into cardiac arrest, about ever 20 minutes or so for around 13 hours-before this all began he made it clear he wanted me to stay with him while he was there. Then sometime after that I began to cry, and it was irritating his sister- who in turn threatened to have me removed, and could not have made that threat had I shared his last name. All I could imagine was not being there and fulfilling what very well could have been his last request of me. Love is something that is ALWAYS worth fighting for. 

Duh! And the sun is made of cotton candy and gin. Didn't you get the memo? 

In all seriousness though, if you believe in evolution you are somehow automatically a Darwinist, If you don't approve of prayer in school-BAM you must be an Atheism, I have even heard of people referring to Catholicism as a polytheistic religion. So anyone who is, approves of, or supports homosexuality MUST in turn be a....a....Homosexianite?  Since it's a fairly new belief I vote we have a mascot too- How about Tinky Winky? OH and you are given skittles instead of wafers at communion.

Sorry, I was thinking the same thing and you opened it up for me to poke fun at.-totally didn't mean to grind anyone's gears. 

Ok, I respect that, and your opinion. Let me try and clarify, because it seems that you may be diverting from the issue with semantics.  

You do see the similarities don't you? Instead of being forced to do something they are denied something else-it's very similar.

And, so you're saying that you could honestly just choose to be gay or straight someday? it is not something you choose, just as you don't choose your skin color- People are being denied what should be basic American rights, because they are born different from the majority. 

Does someone choose to be straight?

That is a trick question. 

Romans 1: 24-32:

24 -25So God said, in effect, "If that's what you want, that's what you get." It wasn't long before they were living in a pigpen, smeared with filth, filthy inside and out. And all this because they traded the true God for a fake god, and worshiped the god they made instead of the God who made them—the God we bless, the God who blesses us. Oh, yes!

26 -27 -- Worse followed. Refusing to know God, they soon didn't know how to be human either—women didn't know how to be women, men didn't know how to be men. Sexually confused, they abused and defiled one another, women with women, men with men—all lust, no love. And then they paid for it, oh, how they paid for it—emptied of God and love, godless and loveless wretches.

28 -32 -- Since they didn't bother to acknowledge God, God quit bothering them and let them run loose. And then all hell broke loose: rampant evil, grabbing and grasping, vicious backstabbing. They made life hell on earth with their envy, wanton killing, bickering, and cheating. Look at them: mean-spirited, venomous, fork-tongued God-bashers. Bullies, swaggerers, insufferable windbags! They keep inventing new ways of wrecking lives. They ditch their parents when they get in the way. Stupid, slimy, cruel, cold-blooded. And it's not as if they don't know better. They know perfectly well they're spitting in God's face. And they don't care—worse, they hand out prizes to those who do the worst things best!

 How disappointing... 

I had a feeling this was going to end up here, and I respectfully decline your invitation to duel, just for the record though, religion should have nothing to do with it,and that's really the issue though. I have yet to have someone approach this topic from the opposite side and provide me with solid grounds for discriminating.

Decline them admittance to your church, but do not deny them the right to be American, or human for that matter. 

Thanks for the discussion. 

Page 1:

Bam_Bam: Remember, this thread is asking whether anti gay rights people are idiots. You are Constitutionally permitted to discriminate, but not to take away someones rights. As in my example in the first post, you can disagree with them, but not fire them because they don't share your morals.

resistance is futile:

Bam_Bam: I believe a private company should not be allowed to not hire someone because they are gay. If it were to somehow interfere with their work, it would be justified. Going back to my example...  Is Boy Scouts of America a private company? It is supposed to be open to boys from all backgrounds. If it is justified to ban gays from BSA, then it should be justified to ban because of race or sex. It is not, however. So what's the difference? You may say that whether or not someone is gay is not based on birth. So what are they supposed to do, divorce their partner? That's like asking a black person to somehow change there skin color because some company is racist.

OtakuJo: Remember: they don't have to change their beliefs, just their actions.

shika_narks:

lostshaker: Even "private" companies must pay men and women equally. They should have to treat gays and straights equally. (I hesitate to use the word "straight," because it indicates that we are morally better.)

resistance is futile: The important thing you said there was that gay discrimination is legal, but that does not make it right.

resistance is futile: (talking to person who you quoted (I can't see who it is because they deleted their post.)) I am not an idiot. What's happening is a minority is being discriminated against.

lostshaker: You are right that it is wrong and also legal. The point is, it shouldn't be legal.

Tureaz'47: I completely agree with your last statement.

Bam_Bam: I agree with you on that one.

Tureaz'47: I am not "religious," unless you consider science a religion.

resistance is futile:

Page 2 coming soon.

Page 2:

resistance is futile: Religion is a concept, but religious people aren't. Homosexuality is also a concept, but homosexual people aren't.

resistance is futile:

Ladydata: I will answer you at Star Trek Logs.

OtakuJo:

Bevi: Exactly.

caltrek2: A reasonable assessment.

Bevi:

lostshaker: If groups don't have rights, then the Boy Scouts of America doesn't have the right to ban gays and atheists.

Bam_Bam: In the case of boy scouts, it is okay to not allow girls because there is a perfectly reasonable alternative: girl scouts.

In response to your third paragraph: So, basically, because a majority of people believe we should take away the rights of a minority, that makes it right?

Bam_Bam: This doesn't make prejudice right.

Bam_Bam: I agree with your first paragraph. As for your second paragraph.... The point of religion is to explain life and occurrences, not necessarily to abide by some standards.

Bam_Bam: True, but it is wrong. Who is hired or fired should be based on skillfulness at that particular job.

>OtakuJo: Remember: they don't have to change their beliefs, just their actions.

If you are talking about attitudes to homosexuality, I think that absolutely depends on the circumstances. Someone with a close family member who happens to be gay -- while they don't have to change their beliefs -- probably would be better to do so. No-one wants to believe that their loved ones cannot accept a central part of themselves.

People who make openly hateful anti-gay statements don't have to change their beliefs, but they would be better people if they could have a more open mind. It's prejudiced attitudes that create the environment of discrimination.

I don't claim to have all the answers but I absolutely believe that people would be better human beings if they learnt to be more accepting of difference.

gay people have the same rights as others.

Where?!? And  wth are these people so upset about then?!? lol

Where?!? And  wth are these people so upset about then?!? lol

I don't have time to respond now, but I can assure you, I will respond.