Vger23 GROUP: Members POSTS: 6718  |
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Mar. 30 2012, 2:21 pm
Kelis-
I think TNG purposefully avoided it to try and not be a "copy" of the dynamics of the original...for better or worse. |
OtakuJo GROUP: Members POSTS: 16220  |
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Mar. 30 2012, 7:20 pm
Quote: KelisThePoet @ Mar. 30 2012, 1:31 pm | >
>So . . . another question for those who say that Picard did not have or need one special friendship: Did we (the audience) need Picard to have that friendship? To me, something is missing from The Next Generation without it.
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Considering the kind of character he was, not really. But whether you need that or not really depends on what kind of character you are.
Next Gen. still had friendship pairings with Geordi / Data and Crusher / Troi etc. Picard, like Worf, was very much a loner -- but the entire senior crew were also friends to varying degrees.
Have you ever danced with a Tribble in the pale moonlight?
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KelisThePoet GROUP: Members POSTS: 588 |
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Mar. 30 2012, 7:23 pm
Quote: | Considering the kind of character he was, not really. But whether you need that or not really depends on what kind of character you are. |
Good answer. 
Falor was a prosperous merchant who went on a journey to gain greater awareness:
Through storms he crossed the Voroth Sea/ To reach the clouded shores of Raal/ Where old T’Para offered truth./ He traveled through the windswept hills/ And crossed the barren Fire Plains/ To find the silent monks of Kir./ Still unfulfilled, he journeyed home/ Told stories of the lessons learned/ And gained true wisdom by the giving.
– Falor’s Journey, “Innocence”
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KelisThePoet GROUP: Members POSTS: 588 |
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Mar. 30 2012, 7:31 pm
Quote: Vger23 @ Mar. 30 2012, 2:21 pm | >Kelis-
>I think TNG purposefully avoided it to try and not be a "copy" of the dynamics of the original...for better or worse. |
You may be right. Maybe the show's creators purposefully avoided giving Picard a best friend out of fear that friend would be interpreted as another "Spock." However, that fear may have been ill-founded. I can think of so many TV shows in different genres off the top of my head that focus on one main character and a core group of 1-3 of his/her friends. So the creators of Next Generation could have written friendship into Picard's character without being too derivative of the original Star Trek.
. . . which of course ducks the question of whether there would be anything wrong with making Picard's relationships derivative of Kirk's. The original show did after all develop a dramatic dynamic that worked for stories about the captain of a space ship.
Falor was a prosperous merchant who went on a journey to gain greater awareness:
Through storms he crossed the Voroth Sea/ To reach the clouded shores of Raal/ Where old T’Para offered truth./ He traveled through the windswept hills/ And crossed the barren Fire Plains/ To find the silent monks of Kir./ Still unfulfilled, he journeyed home/ Told stories of the lessons learned/ And gained true wisdom by the giving.
– Falor’s Journey, “Innocence”
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cowgirlcadet GROUP: Members POSTS: 788 |
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Mar. 31 2012, 8:16 am
Picard's special friend was his goldfish. |
shannon32 GROUP: Members POSTS: 1 |
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Mar. 31 2012, 11:53 am
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Caesar753 GROUP: Members POSTS: 578 |
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Mar. 31 2012, 8:14 pm
Guinan and Crusher seem to be Picard's closest friends. |
megan512 GROUP: Members POSTS: 1321  |
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Apr. 01 2012, 7:29 pm
Quote: janewayjunkie74656 @ Mar. 29 2012, 11:23 pm | Quote: /view_profile/ @ | Quote: /view_profile/ @ | Quote: /view_profile/ @ | Quote: /view_profile/ @ | >
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>Oh and on DS9 Sisko had Dax. (You might choose to count that as a male-female pair before Enterprise, although it gets a little more complicated when considering Curzon for instance.) |
I'll just have to take your word for it, since Deep Space Nine is the only show I haven't seen, since I've been unable to find it in syndication or on low-priced DVDs.
Thanks to everyone for your thoughtful responses. I think the range of these responses, as a set, confirms (or begins to confirm) my initial hypothesis, that Picard does not have one special friend. I don't think there'd be any debate or range of responses if I asked who Kirk's best friend was, and I think there'd be much less debate about Janeway or Archer than there is about Picard (though ServalanFan does bring up some interesting objections to pairing them off with Seven and T'Pol).
My response to some of the individual candidates proposed as Picard's best friend:
I think the creators of the Next Generation movies really tried to push the Picard-Data relationship, in imitation of the Kirk-Spock relationship. I think this imitation was a mistake, as Data and Picard did not have that kind of special friendship in the series. That's the main reason I think Nemesis falls flat with Data's death where Wrath of Khan succeeded with Spock's death.
I didn't see much evidence of Riker being that warm with Picard (or with anyone else for that matter).
I think Crusher's relationship with Picard is more like Janeway's relationship with Chakotay--frequently alluded to in individual stories but not as central to the premise of the entire series as the Kirk-Spock relationship was (or as the Janeway-Seven relationship became, by the end of the Voyager series). On that note, Picard and Guinan as a relationship reminds me of Janeway and Tuvok--closer friends in the backstory than on screen.
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I couldn't agree more on this point. I almost started typing the exact same thing, and I read this and realized you had covered it perfectly.
A close friendship was "manufactured" between Data and Picard for the films. It never felt organic and I never really bought it. I liked Picard as a mentor for Data...but never saw a friendship there.
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I always though Data sort of mildly 'annoyed' Picard because of his immature/childlike behaviour. Am I wrong?
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Perhaps. I guess it could be percieved that way. Data to Picard might have just been one of those annoying friends that you still love at the end of the day.
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Yes, that's it exactly. I was trying to put their relationship into words, but what you said is perfect.
"Captain, life is not a dream." - Spock
"Can you please continue the petty bickering? I find it quite intriguing." - Data
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OtakuJo GROUP: Members POSTS: 16220 |
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Apr. 02 2012, 7:40 am
Quote: cowgirlcadet @ Mar. 31 2012, 8:16 am | >
>Picard's special friend was his goldfish.
> |
Have you ever danced with a Tribble in the pale moonlight?
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Reliant Redshirt GROUP: Members POSTS: 60 |
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Apr. 03 2012, 4:25 pm
I think it would be Dr Crusher, and that the reason he didn't hung arround with people like Kirk did is because he was older than his crew (Kirk was younger than Scotty and about the age of Spock, while Picard was clearly the senior/senile officer on the bridge )
he exploited more the fatherly figure than the leader of the gang that Kirk used.
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OtakuJo GROUP: Members POSTS: 16220 |
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Apr. 03 2012, 5:01 pm
Quote: Reliant Redshirt @ Apr. 03 2012, 4:25 pm | >
>I think it would be Dr Crusher, and that the reason he didn't hung arround with people like Kirk did is because he was older than his crew (Kirk was younger than Scotty and about the age of Spock, while Picard was clearly the senior/senile officer on the bridge)
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I'm not sure that was it -- he described himself as being quite aloof from an early age. But I agree with what you said about him being more of a father figure (or mentor, perhaps) than a buddy to the crew.
Have you ever danced with a Tribble in the pale moonlight?
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guillermo.mejía GROUP: Members POSTS: 2843 |
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Apr. 04 2012, 7:39 am
Although Picard was close to his entire crew, there's little doubt in my mind that that spot falls to Dr. Crusher.
Who else did Picard have over for casual meals? I dodn't remember Riker or Data just chatting him up over lunch.
"Aye. And if my grandmother had wheels she'd be a wagon." - Scotty, The Miracle Worker since 2265.
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Matthias Russell GROUP: Members POSTS: 7705  |
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Apr. 04 2012, 8:30 am
Picard had no special friend. He himself was Q's beloved pet.
Crusher was by far closer to him than any other crewman. Unfortunately, they never developed that in the movies. Picard and Crusher regularly recreated and dined together; she was never afraid to stand up to him. Then the movies came and their relationship was completely neglected.
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This Is Not A Test GROUP: Members POSTS: 13 |
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Apr. 04 2012, 10:42 am
Your dad. Picard called him "his special log," and said he loved to cuddle most of all. |
