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Jadzia or Ezri?

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Created by: the bungalo bill

Dendodge

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POSTS: 945

Report this Jul. 21 2011, 10:58 am

But your first point explains your second - there were more good Jadzia episodes than there were good ezri episodes because she was there for six times as long.  It doesn't make her a better character - there were also a hell of a lot more bad Jadzia episodes than there were bad ezri episodes, and I'd say that Ezri had a much higher percentage og good episodes than Jadzia did.


Mantaray

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POSTS: 2793

Report this Jul. 21 2011, 1:44 pm

Quote: Dendodge @ Jul. 21 2011, 10:58 am

>

>But your first point explains your second - there were more good Jadzia episodes than there were good ezri episodes because she was there for six times as long.  It doesn't make her a better character - there were also a hell of a lot more bad Jadzia episodes than there were bad ezri episodes, and I'd say that Ezri had a much higher percentage og good episodes than Jadzia did.

>


His "points" explain nothing.  


Jadzia was a support character who for six years was used to flush out the personalities of the other lead characters (Sisko-mentor, Kira-sister, Quark/prized possession, Bashir/the one that got away, Worf/mate, Obrien/comrade).


The early episodes of season 7 were distractions from the show as Ezri was foisted upon the viewers to justify her being there. 


You can't compare the two in terms of script as the situations are night and day.


 

dark trekkie

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POSTS: 23

Report this Jul. 21 2011, 2:00 pm

ezri may have been scatty but she had an endearing quality jadzia lacked, jadzia was always bouncing between personas so much she didnt entirely convince me as a character.... ezri was... more realistic and cute to top it off

RedShirtGuyNumber1001

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POSTS: 2016

Report this Jul. 21 2011, 8:27 pm



The thing that irked me about Ezri was that two much work was put into her.  The last season should have focused more on the dominion war so that the finale wouldn't have seemed like such a "poof everything is back to normal, or all is forgiven."


 


Season 6 was so epic, and season 7 was just mismanaged.  I didn't hate Ezri but making those Ezri episodes made the story weaker.  I think some of those epsiodes could have been combined and it still would have been enough to explain what kind of person Ezri is.  I still preferred Jadzia (because she was so incredibly hot), and I thought it sucked that Worf got screwed because of a contract dispute.  He didn't deserve to lose another woman.



OtakuJo

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POSTS: 16362

Report this Jul. 22 2011, 12:51 am

Quote: dark trekkie @ Jul. 21 2011, 2:00 pm

>

>ezri may have been scatty but she had an endearing quality jadzia lacked, jadzia was always bouncing between personas so much she didnt entirely convince me as a character.... ezri was... more realistic and cute to top it off

>


Well a part of that may have had to do with the writing, and the point of DS9 being a new series with a bunch of new characters. The writers of DS9 (as well as Terry Farrell) were having a lot of trouble defining exactly what sort of a character they wanted Dax to be.


It's almost like trying to teach someone to talk by speaking to them in only English for a month, then German for a month, then Japanese, Chinese, sign language, and finally in some obscure dialect or other and wondering why they don't seem to be picking up enough words to communicate properly.


A lot of the time it felt like they were saying, "Well, let's try this instead" First they tried to make her distant and wise, then some kind of lust-object, then they tried to make her a party animal, and finally a warrior / tough woman -- and as a result they were quite late in finding a direction for her to go.


Besides that, and this is no offence to Terry Farrell -- but seeing them both again, I honestly think that Nicole de Boer was / is the better actress.


Have you ever danced with a Tribble in the pale moonlight?

RedShirtGuyNumber1001

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Report this Jul. 22 2011, 8:24 am

Hey OtakuJo you probably don't remember me but hello all the same.  I think you are correct that De Boer is the better actress, however De Boer was not the better Dax.  I think Farrell really liked the character, and I don't think she would have chose to leave like she did had she had her way.  I didn't mind the way her character changed because it reminded me of real life.  Sure DS9 had 7 seasons but I don't think that means that 7 years only passed, we don't know what the time table actually was.  I mean I seriously doubt the Dominion War only lasted 3 months, or that Dukat's time on DS9 when he and The Dominion took it over was only 2 days.  People change over time...thus is life.


In the end I just genuine Farrel was more real then De Boer and it showed in the character.

Dendodge

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Report this Jul. 22 2011, 8:28 am

She left voluntarily, to focus on her film career.  So, yes, she would have chosen to leave if she had hadher way - in fact, she did.


And the timeframe of the series was mentioned a number of times.  People said that they met "two years ago", for example, and numeric years were mentioned.  Couple that with years mentioned in later seasons of TNG and early seasons of VOY, and you have a very strong case for the series taking place over the course of seven years.  To claim otherwise is, frankly, nonsensical.


And, no, Jadzia was not more real than Ezri - the word you're looking for is "more two-dimensional".  Ezri was a better-rounded, more realistic, less "perfect", character.


Mantaray

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Report this Jul. 22 2011, 8:29 am

Quote: dark trekkie @ Jul. 21 2011, 2:00 pm

>

> jadzia was always bouncing between personas so much she didnt entirely convince me as a character..

>


That is the exact quality which made her character so believable to me.  Farrell did a great job of "bouncing between persona's" that she made the Joined Trill a real character.  She was very subtle about shifting demeanor, which people seem to misconstrue.


 

Mantaray

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Report this Jul. 22 2011, 8:30 am

Quote: RedShirtGuyNumber1001 @ Jul. 21 2011, 8:27 pm

>

>The thing that irked me about Ezri was that two much work was put into her.  The last season should have focused more on the dominion war so that the finale wouldn't have seemed like such a "poof everything is back to normal, or all is forgiven."

>Season 6 was so epic, and season 7 was just mismanaged.  I didn't hate Ezri but making those Ezri episodes made the story weaker.  I think some of those epsiodes could have been combined and it still would have been enough to explain what kind of person Ezri is.  I still preferred Jadzia (because she was so incredibly hot), and I thought it sucked that Worf got screwed because of a contract dispute.  He didn't deserve to lose another woman.

>


Odin be praised.   This is dead on correct.


 

Mantaray

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POSTS: 2793

Report this Jul. 22 2011, 8:31 am

Quote: RedShirtGuyNumber1001 @ Jul. 22 2011, 8:24 am

>

>In the end I just genuine Farrel was more real then De Boer and it showed in the character.

>


Again, you echo my sentiments.


 

RedShirtGuyNumber1001

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POSTS: 2016

Report this Jul. 22 2011, 8:46 am

Quote: Dendodge @ Jul. 22 2011, 8:28 am

>

>She left voluntarily, to focus on her film career.  So, yes, she would have chosen to leave if she had hadher way - in fact, she did.

>And the timeframe of the series was mentioned a number of times.  People said that they met "two years ago", for example, and numeric years were mentioned.  Couple that with years mentioned in later seasons of TNG and early seasons of VOY, and you have a very strong case for the series taking place over the course of seven years.  To claim otherwise is, frankly, nonsensical.

>And, no, Jadzia was not more real than Ezri - the word you're looking for is "more two-dimensional".  Ezri was a better-rounded, more realistic, less "perfect", character.

>


You see I don't feel that way at all.  Farrel's Dax was incredibly complex.  Saying that she is two dimensional isn't logically correct.  A Two dimensional character is shallow and has nothing inside.  Paris Hilton would be a two dimensional person.  All show but nothing inside.  The one episode where Dax's former lives are manifested in other crew members basically prooves how complex her character is.


The one failure I think with Ezri is that she didn't have that depth.  If anything she was more two dimensional that Jadzia.  She seemed more like a child in a woman's body to me.  Like I said I don't hate Ezri but I simply feel like the Dax character went from a well rounded and defined individual to a young girl going through puberty.  No offense but that is how I see it.


PS:  I don't think she left for a movie career.  She wasn't that big to make a move like that.  Has she even been in any movies.  All I remember seeing her in after Trek is Trek conventions and Becker....anyone know?

Dendodge

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POSTS: 945

Report this Jul. 22 2011, 8:49 am

That episode showed how three-dimensional Dax could be, but they never really played into it.  Apart from the odd scene with Sisko, and the stuff with Klingons, Dax's former lives didn't do anything to Jadzia's character.


Ezri, on the other hand, had her whole inner struggle thing.  She was confused because she was trying to assert herself against 300 years of other people's memories.  And that - in my opinion - made her more interesting than Jadzia ever was.


And she was cute.


RedShirtGuyNumber1001

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Report this Jul. 22 2011, 9:08 am

Ok she was cute in a Mandy Moore kind of way.  But Jadzia was a goddess.


 


Did she struggle or whine.  Garrack even made a comment to that affect.

Mantaray

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POSTS: 2793

Report this Jul. 22 2011, 9:44 am

Quote: RedShirtGuyNumber1001 @ Jul. 22 2011, 8:46 am

Quote: Dendodge @ Jul. 22 2011, 8:28 am

>

>

>She left voluntarily, to focus on her film career.  So, yes, she would have chosen to leave if she had hadher way - in fact, she did.

>And the timeframe of the series was mentioned a number of times.  People said that they met "two years ago", for example, and numeric years were mentioned.  Couple that with years mentioned in later seasons of TNG and early seasons of VOY, and you have a very strong case for the series taking place over the course of seven years.  To claim otherwise is, frankly, nonsensical.

>And, no, Jadzia was not more real than Ezri - the word you're looking for is "more two-dimensional".  Ezri was a better-rounded, more realistic, less "perfect", character.

>

You see I don't feel that way at all.  Farrel's Dax was incredibly complex.  Saying that she is two dimensional isn't logically correct.  A Two dimensional character is shallow and has nothing inside.  Paris Hilton would be a two dimensional person.  All show but nothing inside.  The one episode where Dax's former lives are manifested in other crew members basically prooves how complex her character is.

The one failure I think with Ezri is that she didn't have that depth.  If anything she was more two dimensional that Jadzia.  She seemed more like a child in a woman's body to me.  Like I said I don't hate Ezri but I simply feel like the Dax character went from a well rounded and defined individual to a young girl going through puberty.  No offense but that is how I see it.

PS:  I don't think she left for a movie career.  She wasn't that big to make a move like that.  Has she even been in any movies.  All I remember seeing her in after Trek is Trek conventions and Becker....anyone know?


Agree 100% with this.


I don't hold Farrell responsible at all, she wanted to showcase more of her acting ability, instead of playing the same background role on DS9.    She had a once in a lifetime opportunity to co-star on a major network with the highest profile actor (Ted Dansen) at the time.   I wished she had waited one more year, but good for her.


 

RedShirtGuyNumber1001

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POSTS: 2016

Report this Jul. 22 2011, 9:53 am

Yeah its a shame things didn't work out.

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