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I have a question to my fellow Trek fans about the views of the various Trek series?

Sora

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2606

Report this Jan. 20 2011, 9:25 pm

Personally, I love all of the Star Trek series, and I love all of the movies. Yes I can agree certain parts are better than others.


However, I've seen many fans say "this and or that sucks" "I hate (insert series here)"


My question is, the Trekkies I've seen going about Bashing Star Trek, do they speak as a whole for the majority of Star Trek fans, or are they simply trolls?


Personally, I love Voyager and I love Enterprise. Enterprise is my 2nd favorite Trek series. From what i've heard from other fans, that's a rare statement.


But do fans actually hate Voyager and Enterprise? And hate Insurrection and Nemesis?


 


Or do you enjoy all of Star Trek, but simply enjoy those series and or those films less than others?


As I said I love all of Trek. However I do my favorites as well. But there's not any part of Trek that I strongly dislike, or don't enjoy.


My series order is


Deep Space Nine


Enterprise


Voyager


The Next Generation


The Original Series


I do know and understand that Voyager and Enterprise do have their share of flaws and mistakes, I just personally enjoy them more. But that's not to say TNG and TOS aren't fantastic either.


Just curious to see some other fans thoughts and views? It stands to reason that there must not be that many fans who actually hate parts of Trek, because how can you be a fan of something you hate?

Lithium Cracking Station

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 17

Report this Jan. 20 2011, 10:28 pm

I hate the word "bash" because when I say an episode or movie is bad or even unwatchable I'm not just going off. I've thought about it and considered the technical and artistic merits.

My problem is that at its high points Star Trek (as a whole) is so good and so powerful. That when a movie or episode doesn't live up to the bar that was set, I get upset and say I hate it.

I love TOS, but some episodes are very poorly made. There's no getting around that. On the other hand several are simply amazing.

I love TNG, but seasons 6 and 7 saw a major decline in story telling. That's just a fact. I don't hate anyone for it, it's just the way it is.

DS9 is uneven. Some episodes are good, others leave me scratching my head. To this day I will never understand the treatment of Kurn and Alexander.

VOY is based on a weak concept and weak characters. A few episodes were okay, but nothing great. Stories for the most part didn't work.

ENT was ill-conceived from the start as well. Prequels don't work (Star Wars anyone?). But worse was the storytelling. It was like no one cared anymore until Manny took over but by then it was to late.

As for the movies:

TMP was just not a big enough idea for a feature, so it suffered from being long and slow.

WOK is one of the best movies ever made star Trek or not.

SFS is good even though it unfairly gets a bad wrap. It's well directed and is exciting.

TVH is excellent all around.

TFF is a mess. Poorly writen, poorly directed.

UDC is a great movie but doesn't compare with WOK or TVH.

All the Next gen movies suffer from the same problem: half-hearted stories. It's like they threw out Star Trek and then tried to make wht they thought would be blockbusters.

Abrams' movie was entertaining and fun, but it doesn't stand anywhere near WOK when you look at the story construction, the acting and the themes (I don't think ST even had any themes). Even though it was a remake of WOK just like Nemesis was it doesn't compare.

So, when I hate somethng Star Trek I'm wishing it lived up to the potential Star Trek has.

Lithium Cracking Station

Camorite

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POSTS: 5510

Report this Jan. 21 2011, 4:13 am

My question is, the Trekkies I've seen going about Bashing Star Trek, do they speak as a whole for the majority of Star Trek fans, or are they simply trolls?


An interesting question. Some say that they are fans of one or more perticular series, and don't care much for the rest, even going as far as to state petty resons for not watching a perticular series. Personally i am with you in the fact that i enjoyed all of the series and movies (including trek09), and feel that anyone that bashes any of the trek series is not a true fan of the franchise as a whole.


"What i Hate more then anything else is someone that thinks that they know everything. That must mean that I really hate myself", "Freedom is the right of all setient beings!" (Optimus Prime: Transformers), "That's on small step for man, one giant leap for mankind!" Neil Armstrong 8-5-30 to 8-25-12

Ghostmojo

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POSTS: 1826

Report this Jan. 21 2011, 5:37 am

I'm no troll - even if I do love The Lord of the Rings!


I think you can be a selective Star Trek fan. I am. I only really care for the first two series, but have recently become more favourably disposed towards Enterprise.


Therefore I would rank the five main series thus:


1) Star Trek : The Original Series (as it is now known)


2) Star Trek : The Next Generation


3) Star Trek : Enterprise (as it eventually became)


4) Star Trek : The Animated Series


5) Star Trek : Phase II (which was sadly never made)


6) Star Trek : Deep Space Nine (interchangeable with (7))


7) Star Trek : Voyager (interchangeable with (6))


to boldy go where no man has gone before

Vger23

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POSTS: 6799

Report this Jan. 21 2011, 8:18 am

I think there are factions of Trek fans who RELISH being negative nit-pickers. They're like the Comic Book Guy from the Simpsons on crack.

It gives Trek fans in general a bad name. They're not trolls, they're for real. That's what makes it even worse.

I AM KEE-ROCK!!

Treknoir

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POSTS: 1784

Report this Jan. 21 2011, 9:09 am

Quote: Vger23 @ Jan. 21 2011, 8:18 am

I think there are factions of Trek fans who RELISH being negative nit-pickers. They're like the Comic Book Guy from the Simpsons on crack. It gives Trek fans in general a bad name. They're not trolls, they're for real. That's what makes it even worse.


ST canon is their truth and Bible and anything less is heresy worthy of cyber burning at the stake.

It is curious how often you humans manage to obtain that which you do not want. - Spock

Tureaz'47

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2605

Report this Jan. 21 2011, 9:23 am

Quote: Sora @ Jan. 20 2011, 9:25 pm

>

>Personally, I love all of the Star Trek series, and I love all of the movies. Yes I can agree certain parts are better than others.

>However, I've seen many fans say "this and or that sucks" "I hate (insert series here)"

>My question is, the Trekkies I've seen going about Bashing Star Trek, do they speak as a whole for the majority of Star Trek fans, or are they simply trolls?

>
Trolls sora. There are aspects about ST. that have flaws, but that doesn't mean that something of a positive interest, shouldn't come out of it. Perhaps it's a reflection of the person and not "Star Trek," at all!?


It's strange, being a catalyst for things that move outside.

Ghostmojo

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 1826

Report this Jan. 21 2011, 9:43 am

Nowt wrong with being honest either way ...

to boldy go where no man has gone before

KelisThePoet

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POSTS: 636

Report this Jan. 21 2011, 12:00 pm

I don't think there's anything wrong with having personal preferences among the series and movies, as long as those preferences are expressed respectfully and with an understanding that they are opinions, not facts about the objective quality of the product. I would not go as far as to say that a person must like all things Star Trek in order to be a fan of the larger franchise.


But, I am glad whenever I get the sense I am not alone as a Trekkie who really does like all Star Trek. The last Star Trek movie I watched was Nemesis, and it is without a doubt my least favorite of the eleven, but I was thoroughly entertained by it and would readily watch it again. Similarly, with the series, Enterprise is my least favorite (of the ones I've seen--I've haven't had the chance to see Deep Space Nine), and I love watching Enterprise.


Falor was a prosperous merchant who went on a journey to gain greater awareness: Through storms he crossed the Voroth Sea/ To reach the clouded shores of Raal/ Where old T’Para offered truth./ He traveled through the windswept hills/ And crossed the barren Fire Plains/ To find the silent monks of Kir./ Still unfulfilled, he journeyed home/ Told stories of the lessons learned/ And gained true wisdom by the giving. – Falor’s Journey, “Innocence”

iBorg13

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POSTS: 1944

Report this Jan. 21 2011, 12:15 pm

I love all Trek, just lyke yhu Sora. My favs are
1. DS9
2/3. ENT/VOY, can't decide
4. TOS
5. TNG
6. TAS
I love all these series but thats moi order. I don't hate any part of Star Trek avidly.
DS9 was great, all about the stories and I can't get enough of it!!! I love the characters from this sereis and they have my favourite captain in it as well!
I'm not entirely sure why I like VOY, but I do, the characters are fascinating and the seasons have been getting better and better (although I am yet to see seasons 6 and 7)
I think people that think ENT's story telling is bad didn't give the series a chance. Hell, if they watched the Pilot alone they would know ENT had great stroy telling to come. But if they watched nearly all the eps from different seasons, then thats fine and they are entitled to their opinion. But ENT had great character developement.
TOS is great fun to watch, especially in its original style with no special effects.
TNG has great stories and I particularly love Season 4.
TAS is alot more enjoyable than I thought it would be...

Sora

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2606

Report this Jan. 21 2011, 3:56 pm

Quote: Camorite @ Jan. 21 2011, 4:13 am

My question is, the Trekkies I've seen going about Bashing Star Trek, do they speak as a whole for the majority of Star Trek fans, or are they simply trolls?

An interesting question. Some say that they are fans of one or more perticular series, and don't care much for the rest, even going as far as to state petty resons for not watching a perticular series. Personally i am with you in the fact that i enjoyed all of the series and movies (including trek09), and feel that anyone that bashes any of the trek series is not a true fan of the franchise as a whole.



Yeah, I agree. I guess I have trouble seeing how you can be a fan of just one Trek series and not the others. The only way I can see that, is if you're a fan of TOS and none of the others. Because in my eyes, they're all connected in some way or another. And yes Star Trek has it's strong and weak points. But I think all of the series were strong at one point and weaker in others.

Personally, I love Season 3 of TOS. That's the season alot of people didn't like. But it's my favorite. I actually find Season 2 of TOS a bit weak.

Everybody knows it's no secret that TNG is very weak in it's 1st season. After watching Season 1 of TNG, it almost makes you wonder how it got a 2nd season,lol but even saying that, there's still a handful of good episodes in season 1. And even though most people aren't crazy about season 2, Season 2 is very good. And I love Season 6 and 7. And if you watch the special features on the dvd, Brent Spiner even says that he feels like Season 6 was the best season of the show, and Season 7 was right behind it.

DS9, has an ok 1st season. Now I feel that Season 2 of DS9 was extremely weak. Seasons 3-7 of DS9 I really felt were amazing.

Voyager, another weak first season. But Season 2 was a really strong season I felt. Season 3 got slow again. And seasons 4-7 were really good. Season 5 and 6 in particular.

Enterprise, I didn't think was ever weak. But if I had to pick a weaker season, I'd say season 4. Which I'm sure will catch alot of people's eyes, because Season 4 is very popular among fans. But Season 1 and 2 are my favorites for Enterprise. Season 3 and 4 are extremely good, don't get me wrong, but for me Season 1 and 2 was like Trek at it's best. I felt like it went back to that classic Trek feel, and I didn't get why people didn't like Enterprise.

Star Wars didn't need a prequel, but Star Trek really kinda did. Because TOS doesn't have much of a beginning. It just jumps right into everything. And I think Enterprise really did a good job at giving a beginning to Star Trek.

As far as the films go, I enjoy every one of them, and Star Trek Insurrection I think could very well be my favorite. Which Insurrection is another one that people tend to not like. But I found it to be a very enjoyable film. I guess because I love politics, and Insurrection was a very political and moral related film, rather than being an action Wrath of Kahn or First Contact. But all 10 movies, I find enjoyable. Now Star Trek 2009, I view that as a remake of TOS. So I hold it separately from the rest of Trek. I do enjoy it, but it simply doesn't compare to Classic Star Trek (1966-2005)

Live Long and Prosper

Sora

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2606

Report this Jan. 21 2011, 4:29 pm

I agree with both KelisThePoet and iBorg13

I don't hold every Trek series at the exact same level, however I hold all of the Star Trek series above any other show. But for instance, TOS is my least favorite of them all, but I still love TOS. I enjoy any and all Trek. I think every Star Trek series has something to offer.

And Kelis, you really should check out Deep Space Nine. It really is a good series. In some ways it feels like an extension of Next Generation.

And iBorg, let me tell you Season 6 and 7 of Voyager, are EXTREMELY good!! Did you enjoy Season 5 of Voyager? Season 6 is probably my favorite season of Voyager, but Season 5 is my 2nd favorite season, and Season 7 is my 3rd favorite. You're going to really love the last two seasons.

And again I agree with both of you that Enterprise is very enjoyable. I love Enterprise. I wish there was some way that we could get another 3 seasons of Enterprise.


Live Long and Prosper

Sora

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2606

Report this Jan. 21 2011, 5:31 pm

Quote: /view_profile/ @

Quote: /view_profile/ @

I'm no troll - even if I do love The Lord of the Rings!

I think you can be a selective Star Trek fan. I am. I only really care for the first two series, but have recently become more favourably disposed towards Enterprise.

Therefore I would rank the five main series thus:

1) Star Trek : The Original Series (as it is now known)

2) Star Trek : The Next Generation

3) Star Trek : Enterprise (as it eventually became)

4) Star Trek : The Animated Series

5) Star Trek : Phase II (which was sadly never made)

6) Star Trek : Deep Space Nine (interchangeable with (7))

7) Star Trek : Voyager (interchangeable with (6))

OMG you like star trek enterprise i thought you hated everything apart from the original series.


That's not what Ghostmojo said at all. I'm starting to think we have a troll in our midsts....

Live Long and Prosper

Sora

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2606

Report this Jan. 21 2011, 5:50 pm

Fair enough, I apologize for the mix up

Live Long and Prosper

iBorg13

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POSTS: 1944

Report this Jan. 21 2011, 10:37 pm

Sora, soz faw de laate wun. Yea! I LOOOVED Voyager's Season 5! It was the best yet, glad to hear they continue that high standard... and with you on that we should've gotten 7 seasons in ENT.

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