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Its Ok to bash Rick Berman but not JJ Abrams

picard_2305

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POSTS: 168

Report this Sep. 30 2010, 4:53 am

Why is it the cool thing to bash Rick Berman but any hate towards JJ Abrams makes you a hater?


It seems a bit double standard to me.


 


I am sure JJ ABrams is a dead on guy but the stuff he produces does not interest me at all. Lost was a pile of crap to me yet it was one of the highest rated shows in recent years. Why?


JJ Abrams made a cool Star Trek movie and as worked well to make Star Trek popular again. I love it as a separate entity from the rest of Trek. Its a great movie and I gave it 4 out 5.


 


But it ain't the best ever Trek which the mainstream seems to believe. I still prefer the original cast over the new ones even though the new ones did a good job playing alternate versions of the characters.


 


Just saying although Rick Berman made a few mistakes a lot of Trek produced under his watch I would prefer over Abrams movie.


I know it's cool to make Trek cool again but why must this movie eclipse all the Trek that came before?

UNTRugby

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POSTS: 1212

Report this Sep. 30 2010, 5:19 am

>>I am sure JJ ABrams is a dead on guy but the stuff he produces does not interest me at all. Lost was a pile of crap to me yet it was one of the highest rated shows in recent years. Why?

Becuase JJ left after season 1. He does this with all his projects which is why i dislike him. Theres a good chance he wont direct the next trek movie and let it go down hill.

jamesspock1

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POSTS: 461

Report this Sep. 30 2010, 12:50 pm

Funny that Trek has been under berman for so long and it was alwayse OK, until the last 2 Trek film. All of a sudden many who claim to be Star Trek Fans spit all over him and claim JJ as a god of Star Trek.
JJ knows nothing about Star Trek he even admited it himself, plus adding his little Star Wars element, shows a disrespect for Trek.
I would like what Star Wars fans would say, if Spock or any other Trek element was put in a Star Wars movie, to give a little Star Trek Element.

picard_2305

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POSTS: 168

Report this Sep. 30 2010, 2:56 pm

Quote: /view_profile/ @

I own every single episode of Trek, can be seen walking the streets in my uniform, and speak a little Klingon. No Trek series is particularly bad in my opinion, and there's bad episodes of all of them. And Trek 11 is my favorite Trek movie. You gotta remember, Trekkies represent a small fraction of the people who enjoy Star Trek. Star Wars fans realize this...



Fair enough. I just feel penalised because I don't like it as much as alot of other Treks

I probably put the new movie in sixth to seventh place. Can I ask fans if I am wrong to put the new movie in that position?

Who am I to argue with the captain of the Enterprise?

Vger23

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POSTS: 6799

Report this Sep. 30 2010, 4:08 pm

I don't bash on Berman OR Abrams. They both made their versions of Star Trek, and there are a lot of people who like them.

Star Trek is about diversity. It's too bad the fans don't get that.

I AM KEE-ROCK!!

2takesfrakes

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POSTS: 3683

Report this Sep. 30 2010, 6:18 pm

I find the whole hate of STAR TREK '09 fascinating.
All of their hate for it - and let's be honest, now -
has nothing to do with anything, but recasting TOS.
That's all. If JJ used the USS YORKTOWN, from the TOS
era, instead and had NERO change the timeline with
THOSE people, there would be no passionate hate for it.
JJ's real balls was in using Kirk and company. Well ...

I don't sympathize with that stance, it's rediculous.
Paramount owns the rights to those characters, to make
money off them any way they want to. That whole LETTER-
WRITING campaign and these conventions put it in the
heads of fans that STAR TREK belongs to them. It never did!
It never will! People amaze me, they really do ...

Tureaz'47

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POSTS: 2605

Report this Sep. 30 2010, 6:44 pm

Quote: /view_profile/ @

>I don't know anyone who considers themselves "cool" by hating on Berman. I consider that to be the opinion of those that really appreciate Berman's contributions to TREK. As far as being a hater if one doesn't have the same view point as those that do appreciate J.J.'s contribution to TREK is due to the fact some don't share the same opinion. Plain and simple. I don't see it as a double standard so much as it's just a matter of personal taste and people some times don't see eye to eye is all. As far as: "I am sure JJ ABrams is a dead on guy but the stuff he produces does not interest me at all. Lost was a pile of crap to me yet it was one of the highest rated shows in recent years. Why?" Simply because Lost appealed to the masses because they could relate to it. His work apparently doesn't appeal to you for some reason and that's ok because everyone is different and has different taste. "JJ Abrams made a cool Star Trek movie and as worked well to make Star Trek popular again. I love it as a separate entity from the rest of Trek. Its a great movie and I gave it 4 out 5." See that's pretty much how I feel. The key thing that most don't get about the movie is that it IS separate from the rest of TREK because of the different timeline. It's not meant to be the same or to replace what has come before. "But it ain't the best ever Trek which the mainstream seems to believe. I still prefer the original cast over the new ones even though the new ones did a good job playing alternate versions of the characters." I agree, it's pretty much average for a TREK movie. "Just saying although Rick Berman made a few mistakes a lot of Trek produced under his watch I would prefer over Abrams movie." I can agree to that to an extent. He made more than a few mistakes AND the best TREK made under his watch he had almost nothing to do with (Deep Space Nine) "I know it's cool to make Trek cool again but why must this movie eclipse all the Trek that came before?" I don't think that it has. It's just that it's the current big thing in TREK right now so it gets more attention than it would if it were made 10 or 15 years ago. Is their really any need for hate towards either person?


I agree with you Bax. Although I disliked JJ's disdain for ST. Fans, the Movie was refereshing. Sort of filled in for those withdrawal symptoms of wanting something new, anything new! Perhaps that was the mistake of fans being negative about "Enterprise" and ot supporting it, which could have been a contributing factor to it being canned early. Now we don't have a series at all? ~sigh~


It's strange, being a catalyst for things that move outside.

KLINGONDOG

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Report this Sep. 30 2010, 7:40 pm

I agree both Berman and Abrams brought to the table, both breathed life into Star Trek. Instead hate the people who decided it was time to end Enterprise.

bortaS bIr jablu'DI' reH QaQqu' nay'.

mutitireaper

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Report this Sep. 30 2010, 9:03 pm

rick berman had kirk off in that tgn movie shat would have loved to have been in the new star trek. and for record kirk did not die in the nexus.

Ahead warp factor 5

DataLore2010

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Report this Sep. 30 2010, 10:17 pm

Rick Berman gets a bad rap but honestly there was a lot of good Trek under his watch. And to me Star Trek: First Contact is still a better overall movie compared to the 2009 film. When you factor in the acting, script and effects FC still stands well against the new film. The 2009 film, I thought was great, I was hooked from the opening scene. However there were many cringe-worthy moments where the acting was truly terrible, I thought Nero was as 2 dimensional as Shinzon was and in retrospect I think Tom Hardy is a better actor. I thought the Star Wars references or rip offs were ridiculous and took away from the overall feeling.

That being said it was still one of the better Star Trek films but to say it was better than Star Trek II, VI, or FC, Nope....not to me. (not that all those had to do with Rick Berman)

Rick and JJ both did great things for Trek but also both made some mistakes. But like the saying goes, you can't make everyone happy! lol

picard_2305

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POSTS: 168

Report this Oct. 01 2010, 12:59 am

Quote: DataLore2010 @ Sep. 30 2010, 10:17 pm

Rick Berman gets a bad rap but honestly there was a lot of good Trek under his watch. And to me Star Trek: First Contact is still a better overall movie compared to the 2009 film. When you factor in the acting, script and effects FC still stands well against the new film. The 2009 film, I thought was great, I was hooked from the opening scene. However there were many cringe-worthy moments where the acting was truly terrible, I thought Nero was as 2 dimensional as Shinzon was and in retrospect I think Tom Hardy is a better actor. I thought the Star Wars references or rip offs were ridiculous and took away from the overall feeling. That being said it was still one of the better Star Trek films but to say it was better than Star Trek II, VI, or FC, Nope....not to me. (not that all those had to do with Rick Berman) Rick and JJ both did great things for Trek but also both made some mistakes. But like the saying goes, you can't make everyone happy! lol


I agree with you, First Contact is an awesome movie and I think it is a better movie overall than Abrams movie. Wrath of Khan, First Contact, Undiscovered Country would my top 3 Star Trek movies.

The new movie is great fun and a well made movie. I do think it has the weakest plot but it still had some great character moments. I will probably be penalised for saying the plot is weak but I really felt that some things were not well developed because of the relentless pace of the film and the fact that middle act does rely on suspension of disbelief and plot contrivances to make the story move.

As I said I don't see JJ Abrams as an Antichrist because as I said he mad e a good movie but I do think the guy is over rated.

JJ is now like Joss Whedon, in which his fans treat him like a god. No man should be treated like a God.


Who am I to argue with the captain of the Enterprise?

kmb035

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POSTS: 91

Report this Oct. 06 2010, 12:51 pm

I dont feel either should be bashed. Rick Berman gave us 25 seasons of trek and four movies that were semi successful. Unfortunately his days were numbered and new writers and a new look was needed. JJ took over and did a hell of a job. If fact I saw elements of both Bennet and Berman in JJ's movies. I love all trek and Im not going to bash either one, sure I have my differences but I love both of their contributions and Im looking forard to star trek Xll. And the continutation of trek in any form. Go JJ and Rick and Harve too.

Kdbtrekkin

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POSTS: 3648

Report this Oct. 06 2010, 1:24 pm

I don't think either should be bashed either. Berman did a great job with his co creations, yeah Voyager seemed a bit of a copy cat, but still wasn't to bad and Enterprise might not have started out great, but frankly I liked it. Also as know Deep Space Nine was awesome and he did a good job on TNG. As for the movies he did, yeah they weren't the greatest, except First Contact, and none are the worst in my book, though Nemesis does rank very near the bottom for me.


 


As for JJ, I liked his take, though I do hope the next two are even better. Some aspects of the new movie I just didn't like, like blowing up Vulcan, death of Amanda and Chekov(maybe he'll do better, but I don't know, I think I just don't like the actor).


"Seek freedom and become captive of your desires, seek discipline and find your liberty." Frank Herbert(Dune)

JaydenJaneway

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Report this Nov. 03 2010, 3:36 pm

i think Berman did an excellent job. it jj abrams that did a terrible job.


Sora

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POSTS: 2606

Report this Nov. 03 2010, 3:43 pm

Quote: picard_2305 @ Sep. 30 2010, 4:53 am

Why is it the cool thing to bash Rick Berman but any hate towards JJ Abrams makes you a hater?

It seems a bit double standard to me.

 

I am sure JJ ABrams is a dead on guy but the stuff he produces does not interest me at all. Lost was a pile of crap to me yet it was one of the highest rated shows in recent years. Why?

JJ Abrams made a cool Star Trek movie and as worked well to make Star Trek popular again. I love it as a separate entity from the rest of Trek. Its a great movie and I gave it 4 out 5.

 

But it ain't the best ever Trek which the mainstream seems to believe. I still prefer the original cast over the new ones even though the new ones did a good job playing alternate versions of the characters.

 

Just saying although Rick Berman made a few mistakes a lot of Trek produced under his watch I would prefer over Abrams movie.

I know it's cool to make Trek cool again but why must this movie eclipse all the Trek that came before?



Remarkable how Star Trek politics, mirrors real life politics.

In the same way how it's popular to bash Bush, but you're a hater if you don't like Obama. Same thing. I don't know why people want to bash Rick Berman. I love the man personally. Rick Berman did an amazing job with Star Trek, and his Trek is far better than J.J. Abrams Trek. The only reason why the new film is mainstream popular, is because it's a mindless action movie. It's not about science and you don't have to use your brain to watch it. That's why it's popular. People don't want to have to think.

Live Long and Prosper

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