ATTENTION: The Boards will be closed permanently on May 28th, 2014. Posting will be disabled on April 28th, 2014. More Info

Kes and Neelix' Breakup

Passionfruit

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 10184

Report this May. 18 2010, 4:19 pm

I think I missed an episode. In 'Darkling' they had already broken up, but in which episode did it happen exactly?

kludge77

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 1477

Report this May. 18 2010, 4:23 pm

Quote (Passionfruit @ May 18 2010, 1:19 am)
I think I missed an episode. In 'Darkling' they had already broken up, but in which episode did it happen exactly?

I want to say Warlord....

vadic

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 1289

Report this May. 18 2010, 7:21 pm

Quote (kludge77 @ May 17 2010, 5:23 pm)
Quote (Passionfruit @ May 18 2010, 1:19 am)
I think I missed an episode. In 'Darkling' they had already broken up, but in which episode did it happen exactly?

I want to say Warlord....

It was indeed Warlord, as I remember. She just didn't have the same feelings for Neelix which is understandable. She was only like 2 or 3 years old.  ;)

subytrek

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 39018

Report this May. 18 2010, 7:44 pm

Neelix was a pedophile! :O

Lynx677

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 7859

Report this May. 19 2010, 1:13 pm

Kes and Neelix did break up in "Warlord".

Unfortunately the break-up was badly handled. Kes is taken over by an alien entity and the entity, the warlord Tieran dumps Neelix as a part of his plan. When Kes is liberated from Tieran's presence (by the Voyager crew, including Neelix) the relationship remains broken up and no explanations why.

What they should have done was a break-up during 2-3 episodes shortly after "Parturition" in season 2 where it's described how Kes is getting tired of Neelix's jealousy and over-protection and decides to dump him for that.

Passionfruit

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 10184

Report this May. 23 2010, 8:02 am

Ah, yes, I saw Warlord, but presumed it wasn't a real break up because of the reasons already mentioned.

Phantomoftheopera

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 12005

Report this May. 23 2010, 3:54 pm

Jennifer Lien did some great acting in Warlord.

Quantumflux01

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 428

Report this May. 23 2010, 5:17 pm

Quote (subytrek @ May 19 2010, 12:44 am)
Neelix was a pedophile! :O

Yeah right. Kes may have been 2, but she wasn't a Ocompa child. So Neelix isn't a pedophile.

KelisThePoet

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 636

Report this Jun. 22 2010, 1:28 am

This topic really highlights one of the reasons I grew to dislike the Kes character by Season 3. I didn't think the Kes-Neelix relationship was perfect--not for the two characters or for viewers. But it had gone on too long, was too meaningful and was too central to the show's setup in "Caretaker" for the writers to just abandon it without any sufficient explanation (really without any explanation at all). And since Neelix does not seem to have initiated the breakup, even in part, Kes comes across as the bad person who drops someone who has cared and sacrificed a great deal for her, for no articulable reason at all. Kes' treatment of Neelix in this respect highlights and amplifies her insensitivity to other members of the crew in episodes like "Darkling," leaving me with the impression that one of Voyager's most compassionate, sensitive characters has metamorphosed into easily the most selfish.

Passionfruit

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 10184

Report this Jun. 23 2010, 2:08 pm

I think it was just unorganized writing like an episode was missing. Pity they showed so little consideration...would have fitted well if they wrote an episode where Kes develops in a direction where she looses interest in Neelix or something like that...

brcarthey

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2608

Report this Jun. 23 2010, 2:17 pm

there was actually a filmed, but deleted, scene in sickbay (when neelix is gathering supplies for the trip to the surface) from "blood fever" that ethan phillips has spoken of where kes and neelix have a poignant moment where they acknowledge the end of their relationship. that's scene that should've been kept in, but wasn't due to time constraints.

Passionfruit

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 10184

Report this Jun. 25 2010, 7:51 pm

Good it wasn't in Blood Fever. Really like that episode and too much diverse stuff would make it look like a soap opera. And there was already enough action... :laugh:

chr3335

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 7914

Report this Jun. 29 2010, 11:50 pm

Quote (KelisThePoet @ June 21 2010, 2:28 am)
This topic really highlights one of the reasons I grew to dislike the Kes character by Season 3. I didn't think the Kes-Neelix relationship was perfect--not for the two characters or for viewers. But it had gone on too long, was too meaningful and was too central to the show's setup in "Caretaker" for the writers to just abandon it without any sufficient explanation (really without any explanation at all). And since Neelix does not seem to have initiated the breakup, even in part, Kes comes across as the bad person who drops someone who has cared and sacrificed a great deal for her, for no articulable reason at all. Kes' treatment of Neelix in this respect highlights and amplifies her insensitivity to other members of the crew in episodes like "Darkling," leaving me with the impression that one of Voyager's most compassionate, sensitive characters has metamorphosed into easily the most selfish.

One of the many thing the Voyager writers had potential for and just ignored it because they just didn't feel like doing anything with it.

The Kes Nelix relationship was one of the more interesting things about Voyager even if they didn't seem to fit.  Kes being the sweet innocent girlfriend and Nelix being the crazy possessive creepy boyfriend.

Lynx677

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 7859

Report this Jun. 30 2010, 4:55 pm

Quote (KelisThePoet @ June 21 2010, 2:28 am)
This topic really highlights one of the reasons I grew to dislike the Kes character by Season 3. I didn't think the Kes-Neelix relationship was perfect--not for the two characters or for viewers. But it had gone on too long, was too meaningful and was too central to the show's setup in "Caretaker" for the writers to just abandon it without any sufficient explanation (really without any explanation at all). And since Neelix does not seem to have initiated the breakup, even in part, Kes comes across as the bad person who drops someone who has cared and sacrificed a great deal for her, for no articulable reason at all. Kes' treatment of Neelix in this respect highlights and amplifies her insensitivity to other members of the crew in episodes like "Darkling," leaving me with the impression that one of Voyager's most compassionate, sensitive characters has metamorphosed into easily the most selfish.

But remember that it wasn't Kes who broke up with Neelix but Tieran who was in control of Kes's body and mind at that time. It was a part of his plan to seize power on the planet. So don't blame Kes in this matter.

The sad thing is that it was very badly handled by the writers. If there should have been a Kes-Neelix break-up, then it should have occurred during 2-3 episodes, most likely after "Parturition" and been more carefully explained.



brcarthey wrote:
Quote
there was actually a filmed, but deleted, scene in sickbay (when neelix is gathering supplies for the trip to the surface) from "blood fever" that ethan phillips has spoken of where kes and neelix have a poignant moment where they acknowledge the end of their relationship. that's scene that should've been kept in, but wasn't due to time constraints.


Really sad that they dropped that one. It would have been the only thing worth remember in that episode which is none of my favorites, to say the least.

KelisThePoet

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 636

Report this Jul. 01 2010, 6:53 pm

Quote (Lynx677 @ June 30 2010, 4:55 pm)
But remember that it wasn't Kes who broke up with Neelix but Tieran who was in control of Kes's body and mind at that time. It was a part of his plan to seize power on the planet. So don't blame Kes in this matter.

Well, if it was all Tieran's doing, than Kes should have immediately come to Neelix as soon as she was free of Tieran's control and cleared everything up. The fact that she didn't means that she either chose to break up with him, via Tieran, for no reason I can understand, or that she just decided the issue was not important enough for her attention, which is quite the decision to make about someone so close to her that she donated a lung to him. And even if Kes did want to break up with Neelix, though there seems to be no reason why, she had a right to do so, but she had an obligation to clear things up about it herself, because Neelix couldn't be expected to know where the two stood based on his conversation with Tieran-as-Kes.

(My assumption is that Kes and Neelix must have had some version of the conversation from the deleted scene, off screen, but that leaves me with little reason to suspect Kes handled things well, given the way she was portrayed onscreen at that point in the series.)

So I do blame Kes--as far as it's logical to blame a fictional character for anything. What I mean to say is that I blame Kes as she was written, of course, so my real frustrations are with the people who made the decision to portray her the way she was portrayed.

Forum Permissions

You cannot post new topics in this forum

You cannot reply to topics in this forum

You cannot delete posts in this forum