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Save The Whales

stovokor2000

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2683

Report this Mar. 27 2010, 12:18 pm

Quote (williamslakesm @ Mar. 27 2010, 4:11 am)
Couldn't old Spock just tell them,

It would be unlike him to do so.

Quote
by the way One of the Voyager probes is returning to earth with a vengence on this date and time,


True but that doestnt mean it will reach earth.

cptdon

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 320

Report this Mar. 27 2010, 4:16 pm

They don't need to show us. We can just assume they deal with it and we get to see a new adventure. Maybe something comes looking for Vulcan. I have nothing beyond that but it could be a start to a 200 million dollar movie :D

stovokor2000

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2683

Report this Mar. 28 2010, 12:13 am

Quote (ServalanFan @ Mar. 27 2010, 10:36 pm)
Quote (starbase63 @ Feb. 22 2010, 11:09 am)
Quote (dmcck @ Feb. 21 2010, 6:29 pm)
I really just have one question for J.J. Abrams: What is your plan to save the whales?

In this new timeline he has created there is certain to be one constant: In the year 2286 the 'Whale Probe' will visit Earth; there is no way that Nero coming to the year 2233 could save the whales from extinction in the 21st century. So what is J.J. Abrams plan to save the humpback whales (and Earth) without remaking "Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home"?



P.S. I am brand new to these forums so forgive me if I am posting on a topic that has already been brought up.

The whale probe from STIV:TVH may NOT be a constant, as we don't know when or from where it started it's way toward Earth.

The constants that are definitely still "out there" are:

V'Ger
The SS Botany Bay
The Doomsday Machine
Yonada
Nomad

:logical:

plus
Big giant amoeba thingy
Denevan parasites
Sybok
Asteroid to Paradise Syndrome planet
Khan

You gotta think Spock is going to tell them about some of these things

No you got to think that Spock Prime wont be telling them about any of those things.

It would be completely out of character for him to reveal all of that.

stovokor2000

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2683

Report this Mar. 28 2010, 12:37 pm

Quote (ServalanFan @ Mar. 28 2010, 9:03 am)
Quote (stovokor2000 @ Mar. 28 2010, 12:13 am)
Quote (ServalanFan @ Mar. 27 2010, 10:36 pm)
Quote (starbase63 @ Feb. 22 2010, 11:09 am)
Quote (dmcck @ Feb. 21 2010, 6:29 pm)
I really just have one question for J.J. Abrams: What is your plan to save the whales?

In this new timeline he has created there is certain to be one constant: In the year 2286 the 'Whale Probe' will visit Earth; there is no way that Nero coming to the year 2233 could save the whales from extinction in the 21st century. So what is J.J. Abrams plan to save the humpback whales (and Earth) without remaking "Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home"?



P.S. I am brand new to these forums so forgive me if I am posting on a topic that has already been brought up.

The whale probe from STIV:TVH may NOT be a constant, as we don't know when or from where it started it's way toward Earth.

The constants that are definitely still "out there" are:

V'Ger
The SS Botany Bay
The Doomsday Machine
Yonada
Nomad

:logical:

plus
Big giant amoeba thingy
Denevan parasites
Sybok
Asteroid to Paradise Syndrome planet
Khan

You gotta think Spock is going to tell them about some of these things

No you got to think that Spock Prime wont be telling them about any of those things.

It would be completely out of character for him to reveal all of that.

Why wouldn't/shouldn't he tell them?

Why would he tell them??

It goes against everything Spock stands for and believes in to tell them.

Quote

For instance what are the chances that that Vulcan ship meets the giant amoeba thingy? Pretty low since Vulcan is gone. Prime Spock needs to warn then IMO.


The chanced are proverbially still pretty good.

Most likliy any Vulcan that was serving on that ship were already off planet.

Whitestar7

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 419

Report this Mar. 28 2010, 12:46 pm

Quote (ServalanFan @ Mar. 27 2010, 10:03 am)
Quote (stovokor2000 @ Mar. 28 2010, 12:13 am)
Quote (ServalanFan @ Mar. 27 2010, 10:36 pm)
Quote (starbase63 @ Feb. 22 2010, 11:09 am)
Quote (dmcck @ Feb. 21 2010, 6:29 pm)
I really just have one question for J.J. Abrams: What is your plan to save the whales?

In this new timeline he has created there is certain to be one constant: In the year 2286 the 'Whale Probe' will visit Earth; there is no way that Nero coming to the year 2233 could save the whales from extinction in the 21st century. So what is J.J. Abrams plan to save the humpback whales (and Earth) without remaking "Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home"?



P.S. I am brand new to these forums so forgive me if I am posting on a topic that has already been brought up.

The whale probe from STIV:TVH may NOT be a constant, as we don't know when or from where it started it's way toward Earth.

The constants that are definitely still "out there" are:

V'Ger
The SS Botany Bay
The Doomsday Machine
Yonada
Nomad

:logical:

plus
Big giant amoeba thingy
Denevan parasites
Sybok
Asteroid to Paradise Syndrome planet
Khan

You gotta think Spock is going to tell them about some of these things

No you got to think that Spock Prime wont be telling them about any of those things.

It would be completely out of character for him to reveal all of that.

Why wouldn't/shouldn't he tell them?
The timeline in this universe has been altered. Shouldn't he try to repair it?
For instance what are the chances that that Vulcan ship meets the giant amoeba thingy? Pretty low since Vulcan is gone. Prime Spock needs to warn then IMO.

It has been confirmed by Orci, Kutzman, and Nimoy, as well as in the movie that Star Trek (2009) is an alternate/parallel universe/timeline. The scene between Spock and Spock Prime at the end of the film is proof of this:

Quote
Spock Prime: There are so few Vulcans left, we cannot afford to ignore each other.

Spock: Then why did you send Kirk onboard when you alone could have explained the truth.

Spock Prime: Because you needed each other. I could not deprive you of the revelation of all you could accomplish together. Of a friendship that would define you both. In ways you could not yet realize.

Spock: How did you persuade him to keep your secret?

Spock Prime: He inferred that universe ending paradoxes would ensue should he break his promise.

Spock: You lied.

Spock Prime: Aw... I implied.


Thus, the prime timeline remains unaffected or unaltered, it will continue on it course, so its pointless for Spock Prime to reveal his warnings because it is a new timeline. However, if he chooses to do so anyway, that is his prerogative, but it won't change or erase the prime timeline, just the same.

cptdon

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 320

Report this Mar. 29 2010, 12:03 am

Quote (Whitestar7 @ Mar. 28 2010, 12:46 pm)
Quote (ServalanFan @ Mar. 27 2010, 10:03 am)
Quote (stovokor2000 @ Mar. 28 2010, 12:13 am)
Quote (ServalanFan @ Mar. 27 2010, 10:36 pm)
Quote (starbase63 @ Feb. 22 2010, 11:09 am)
Quote (dmcck @ Feb. 21 2010, 6:29 pm)
I really just have one question for J.J. Abrams: What is your plan to save the whales?

In this new timeline he has created there is certain to be one constant: In the year 2286 the 'Whale Probe' will visit Earth; there is no way that Nero coming to the year 2233 could save the whales from extinction in the 21st century. So what is J.J. Abrams plan to save the humpback whales (and Earth) without remaking "Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home"?



P.S. I am brand new to these forums so forgive me if I am posting on a topic that has already been brought up.

The whale probe from STIV:TVH may NOT be a constant, as we don't know when or from where it started it's way toward Earth.

The constants that are definitely still "out there" are:

V'Ger
The SS Botany Bay
The Doomsday Machine
Yonada
Nomad

:logical:

plus
Big giant amoeba thingy
Denevan parasites
Sybok
Asteroid to Paradise Syndrome planet
Khan

You gotta think Spock is going to tell them about some of these things

No you got to think that Spock Prime wont be telling them about any of those things.

It would be completely out of character for him to reveal all of that.

Why wouldn't/shouldn't he tell them?
The timeline in this universe has been altered. Shouldn't he try to repair it?
For instance what are the chances that that Vulcan ship meets the giant amoeba thingy? Pretty low since Vulcan is gone. Prime Spock needs to warn then IMO.

It has been confirmed by Orci, Kutzman, and Nimoy, as well as in the movie that Star Trek (2009) is an alternate/parallel universe/timeline. The scene between Spock and Spock Prime at the end of the film is proof of this:

Quote
Spock Prime: There are so few Vulcans left, we cannot afford to ignore each other.

Spock: Then why did you send Kirk onboard when you alone could have explained the truth.

Spock Prime: Because you needed each other. I could not deprive you of the revelation of all you could accomplish together. Of a friendship that would define you both. In ways you could not yet realize.

Spock: How did you persuade him to keep your secret?

Spock Prime: He inferred that universe ending paradoxes would ensue should he break his promise.

Spock: You lied.

Spock Prime: Aw... I implied.


Thus, the prime timeline remains unaffected or unaltered, it will continue on it course, so its pointless for Spock Prime to reveal his warnings because it is a new timeline. However, if he chooses to do so anyway, that is his prerogative, but it won't change or erase the prime timeline, just the same.

Despite what they say, I will believe the prime time line still exist when they base a cannon movie or TV show off of it. Other then that, they say it exist to appease the fans of cannon.

yes this is just my opinion...

stovokor2000

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2683

Report this Mar. 29 2010, 1:26 pm

Quote (ServalanFan @ Mar. 29 2010, 9:06 am)
I'm trying to understand why people think its OK for PrimeSpock to keep his knowledge of the future a secret.

Because telli them about the future would most likely make matters worse and change the timeline further.

Your just not seeing the big picture.

Think about it.If I was to tell you that in May your going to be in a car accident in New York wouldnt you try your hardest to make sure that doesnt happan???

Lets say we use your thinking, and Spock Prime decides to tell them that in about 10 years they will encounter the Doomsday machine.

Do you really think Kirk or Starfleet is going to just wait around 10 years for the Doomsday machine to come along??

Or are they going to try to stop it before it reaches federation space???

Or lets say Spock Prime tells them that in 10 years they will encounter the giant space amoeba and how it not only destroyed the crew of the USS Intrepid but a few star systems.

Do you think starfleet is just going to wait for the amoeba to start destroying star systems before doing something about it???

No.

In both cases starfleet would most likely launch a preemptive strike against those dangers.

And the after effect of those attacks would mean a completely different outcome then that of the original timeline.

Any Danger from the future that Spock Prime tells them about wouldnt ensure the right timeline, it would only further pollute the timeline and change it further.

Quote
I know this is an A/U Universe so the Prime Universe is unaffected but wouldn't Spock try to save as many beings as possible in any universe?


From Spocks preservative these people already died in those events.

And telling them about those events could lead to new deaths.

Trying to save them would only further change the timeline.
Quote

Or at least rectify any affect his and Nero's appearance have made in this universe.


Theb only way he could really do that would be to go further back in time and prevent the attack on the Kelvin.

ENT567

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 5267

Report this Apr. 23 2010, 7:31 am

Quote
I really just have one question for J.J. Abrams: What is your plan to save the whales?

I doubt he thinks that would be profitable enough.

Holberg

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 1047

Report this Apr. 23 2010, 10:07 am

Quote (dmcck @ Feb. 21 2010, 6:29 pm)
I really just have one question for J.J. Abrams: What is your plan to save the whales?

In this new timeline he has created there is certain to be one constant: In the year 2286 the 'Whale Probe' will visit Earth; there is no way that Nero coming to the year 2233 could save the whales from extinction in the 21st century. So what is J.J. Abrams plan to save the humpback whales (and Earth) without remaking "Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home"?



P.S. I am brand new to these forums so forgive me if I am posting on a topic that has already been brought up.

The best way is to go back and set the time line right :laugh:  :laugh:  :laugh:  :laugh:  :laugh:

DarthRage

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 289

Report this Apr. 23 2010, 10:24 am

The future is already changed. As human as Spock was in this movie, I would not be surprised at all if he leaked a few tidbits of what's to come to certain people. Older Spock seemed to have embraced his human side whole-heartedly after the destruction of his home planet. Next to that, information on things to come may not be as important to hide to him at this point.

SpaceTherapist

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 6370

Report this Apr. 23 2010, 12:13 pm

For those of us, like myself, who believe that the original time line has been changed there are a couple of ways to look at this. 1. The events of the old time line may never happen or 2. they will happen but maybe in a slightly different way.

If they have a possibility of happening again I think Spock would alter them to what is coming.

But on a more practical view, I really don't think the future movies in this altered time line is going to focus on those old events.

31st_Century_Temporal_Age
nt

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 845

Report this Apr. 24 2010, 2:01 am

Quote (SpaceTherapist @ April 23 2010, 12:13 pm)
For those of us, like myself, who believe that the original time line has been changed there are a couple of ways to look at this. 1. The events of the old time line may never happen or 2. they will happen but maybe in a slightly different way.

If they have a possibility of happening again I think Spock would alter them to what is coming.

But on a more practical view, I really don't think the future movies in this altered time line is going to focus on those old events.

To take it even a step further whatever Spock Prime may or may not reveal if this new timeline will never be mentioned on screen. Best we will ever get out of that is fan fiction. Nimoy will not be in any more Trek or anything else since he has announced his retirement.

And reusing previous themes like Khan or any other original series item is most likely out but more possible than seeing Nimoy okay. I actually wrote a fan fiction script for Star Trek: The Rise Of Khan since it may never come to play. Pm me if you want to read it.

As far as Vger and the Probe yes they will most certainly occur in this new timeline right about the same time frame as before. Will we ever see it on screen? Doubtful for many reasons. First off Vger won't be around till 2273 which is another 15 years from when Trek 11 took place so the actors would have to be a lot older and the movie series fast forwarded.

On the same note the Whale Probe won't be around for another 28 years since Trek 11 which is all but out. I can imagine if these things were reused but set around 2258. Trek fans would be screaming for JJ's head.

Even certain TOS encounters like Doomsday Machine are somewhat impractical since that would be another 8 years away. The only real plausible themes that could within the realm of possibility be used due to the Enterprise's course change will be listed below. Well a popular list I suppose.

Khan can be found earlier.

The planet Trelene was one may be found earlier.

I could actually live with an updated Cheron racism theme in the next Trek movie but the racism allegory may be too far out of date.

If any theme were reused I would love to see a bad ass Harry Mudd allied with the Orion Syndicate. Before you left ST we actually talked about this.

The planet the Guardian was on would make for a great movie  if they had to travel to a different time then the 30's it would be interesting. But I know this one's out.

The way to Eden would be great if not funnier. I can imagine new Kirk getting down and partying with them! :p Whereas new Spock would be ticked off instead of playing his Vulcan Lyre with them. I can imagine Prime Spock coming aboard the Enterprise having a jam session with them and getting nostalgic about getting to do this twice in one lifetime in different timelines. LOL!

cptdon

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 320

Report this Apr. 24 2010, 3:04 am

I find the lack of faith in this run of Star Trek lasting any amount of years into the future fascinating. It seems to be the opinion of many who post, eve the ones who love it, that this version of Trek will not be around 20 years from now.

SpaceTherapist

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 6370

Report this Apr. 24 2010, 12:40 pm

Quote (cptdon @ April 23 2010, 4:04 am)
I find the lack of faith in this run of Star Trek lasting any amount of years into the future fascinating. It seems to be the opinion of many who post, eve the ones who love it, that this version of Trek will not be around 20 years from now.

I certainly don't feel that way. In fact I hope and pray this new time line and run of trek movies lasts a very long long time.

cptdon

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 320

Report this Apr. 24 2010, 7:25 pm

Good, it is just when someone brings up an event that happened further along in the time line I get the feeling that some think 8, 10, 28 years is something we wont see. That is all, I hope it stays around too, kinda ;)

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