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Star Trek Insurection

Vger23

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POSTS: 6799

Report this Jan. 11 2010, 8:52 am

Based on some reading I've done, it sounds like Insurrection suffered from the same problem that some of the other "mediocre" Trek movies suffered from: too much "direction" from the studio and too many self-interested hands in the story development.

The big problem with the two Trek movie franchises was the fact that the studio and the producers KNEW that it wouldn't work without the entire original cast(s). Unfortunately, the casts knew this too, and often threw their weight around to get the story arcs they wanted or to have key themes changed. Sometimes, it wasn't for the best of the picture. When you combine this with the typical studio morons saying "no, this film needs to be a bit more light," you're going to end up with a problem.

INS was the worst example of this problem manifesting itself in ultimately resulted in the worst movie in the series, in my opinion.

Clownprince23

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POSTS: 102

Report this Jan. 11 2010, 12:47 pm

Quote (Vger23 @ Jan. 11 2010, 8:52 am)
Based on some reading I've done, it sounds like Insurrection suffered from the same problem that some of the other "mediocre" Trek movies suffered from: too much "direction" from the studio and too many self-interested hands in the story development.

The big problem with the two Trek movie franchises was the fact that the studio and the producers KNEW that it wouldn't work without the entire original cast(s). Unfortunately, the casts knew this too, and often threw their weight around to get the story arcs they wanted or to have key themes changed. Sometimes, it wasn't for the best of the picture. When you combine this with the typical studio morons saying "no, this film needs to be a bit more light," you're going to end up with a problem.

INS was the worst example of this problem manifesting itself in ultimately resulted in the worst movie in the series, in my opinion.

Do you have any examples of actors or producers throwing their weight around to change the script?

I believe you when you say  this, I'm just curious to see what happened.

Vger23

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POSTS: 6799

Report this Jan. 11 2010, 1:19 pm

Well, using INS for example, it was Patrick Stewart who insisted on a lighter tone and on the idea of Picard having a love-interest. He also insisted that the captain be more a part of "the action" than in the past (more on-par with his role in FC).

So, sometimes the "weight throwing" works well, sometimes not.

Brent Spiner had some story input into INS as well, and I BELIEVE (though, I'd have to check) that the singing part was his idea.

The TOS movies had a lot of it too...but usually that worked out for the better.

JazzTNG

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POSTS: 108

Report this Jan. 11 2010, 4:37 pm

Personally, I do not understand all of the hatred that Insurrection seems to get. For me, Insurrection is an extremely fun film, its humor and romance being a great follow-up to the dark and dreary (but my personal Trek favorite) First Contact, and one that I can revisit time and time again.

In fact, I would go as far as saying that Insurrection has the best mixture of laughs and thrills that the Trek film series would ever see (up until this point). Plus, Frakes does an excellent job with both the visual presentation and emotional feel of the film, the great F. Murray Abraham gives a terrific villain performance (I would say the best since Montalban), Donna Murphy gives a very graceful and sweet supporting performance, the special effects are great, Patrick Stewart and Brent Spiner are as top-notch as usual (with a particularly great Stewart), and the film offers great themes about individual governance, standing up for what is right, and taking time in life to appreciate the small things and moments that we often times take for granted.

But that is just me - and considering that I prefer the TNG films and TV episodes over all the others in almost every way (if not in every way), I might be a bit biased. However, I cannot quite wrap my head around all the criticisms that the TNG films seem to get - and Insurrection is my #2 favorite Trek film after First Contact.

Vger23

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POSTS: 6799

Report this Jan. 11 2010, 5:13 pm

Quote (JazzTNG @ Jan. 11 2010, 4:37 pm)
Personally, I do not understand all of the hatred that Insurrection seems to get. For me, Insurrection is an extremely fun film, its humor and romance being a great follow-up to the dark and dreary (but my personal Trek favorite) First Contact, and one that I can revisit time and time again.

In fact, I would go as far as saying that Insurrection has the best mixture of laughs and thrills that the Trek film series would ever see (up until this point). Plus, Frakes does an excellent job with both the visual presentation and emotional feel of the film, the great F. Murray Abraham gives a terrific villain performance (I would say the best since Montalban), Donna Murphy gives a very graceful and sweet supporting performance, the special effects are great, Patrick Stewart and Brent Spiner are as top-notch as usual (with a particularly great Stewart), and the film offers great themes about individual governance, standing up for what is right, and taking time in life to appreciate the small things and moments that we often times take for granted.

But that is just me - and considering that I prefer the TNG films and TV episodes over all the others in almost every way (if not in every way), I might be a bit biased. However, I cannot quite wrap my head around all the criticisms that the TNG films seem to get - and Insurrection is my #2 favorite Trek film after First Contact.

I think, as you said, it is really a matter of individual tastes.

I agree that the TNG films are almost universally considered inferior to the TOS films and the new Trek movie, with the exception of First Contact, which still is not considered as good as some of those movies. I feel the same way. I never got the same level of entertainment or excitement from the TNG films as a whole that I got from the TOS films as a whole.

I don't HATE Insurrection by any stretch. I just think it's a bland, uninspired, tepid, unengaging, contrived, and silly Star Trek movie. There was nothing in it that made me feel ANY level of excitement, drama, suspense, or fun (with the exception of Geordi regaining his vision...which was the only genuine moment in the film for me). That being the case, it's still a movie I will repeat-watch on occasion (admittedly far less than any of the other Trek movies) because it's still better than a lot of general movies that are out there.

We all have different tastes. Most people hated Nemesis with every fiber of their being, for instance...but I actually enjoyed that movie ALMOST as much (if not AS much) as First Contact. Another example: Just about everyone on the planet loved Star Trek IV, but it is my least-favorite TOS movie. An even more contemporary example is that critics, fans and general audiences were nearly unanimous in their praise for the newest movie, but there are fans here who really hated it.

Everyone has a different take on what they like and dislike about Trek. What makes Trek so great is that it is a "diverse enough portfolio" so that there is always something for everyone. So long as nobody tries to force their opinion on you as if it were FACT, it shouldn't be a problem. There's a lot of petty "TNG is better than ENT" or "Picard is the BEST EVER" kind of stuff that floats around that we can really do without.

JazzTNG

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POSTS: 108

Report this Jan. 11 2010, 5:39 pm

Quote (Vger23 @ Jan. 11 2010, 5:13 pm)
.... Everyone has a different take on what they like and dislike about Trek. What makes Trek so great is that it is a "diverse enough portfolio" so that there is always something for everyone. So long as nobody tries to force their opinion on you as if it were FACT, it shouldn't be a problem. There's a lot of petty "TNG is better than ENT" or "Picard is the BEST EVER" kind of stuff that floats around that we can really do without. ....

Well said, I completely agree - the great thing about films series like Star Trek (or James Bond or Batman, etc.) is that there is a lot of variety and something for everyone.

Zaltar

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POSTS: 3014

Report this Jul. 17 2010, 5:52 pm

Insurrection is my favorite TNG movie


"Truly, these times of ignorance GOD overlooked, but now commands all men everywhere to repent, because HE has appointed a day on which HE will judge the world in righteousness by the MAN (LORD JESUS CHRIST) whom HE has ordained. HE has given assurance of this to all by raising HIM from the dead." [Acts 17:30-31] http://www.intouch.org/god

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