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Nemesis Gets Better Every Time I Watch It

Thyla

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POSTS: 81

Report this Sep. 04 2009, 11:31 pm

Like many people, I walked away from ST:N very disappointed. However, as time passes, it keeps getting stronger for me, not only as a ST movie, but as a film in its own right. While I do believe that the film would have been strengthened by the inclusion of much of the cut material - and possibly by having had Frakes as director instead of Baird - the fact is, I keep finding more to like in it. I've seen it four times now - three of those viewings in the past year, the last one a week ago with a friend who had never watched it before. We talked for an hour about the film, and our discussion was ended only because I had to leave. I'd say that ST:N is the most openly cerebral of the ST movies after the original film. And it certainly has my favorite 'nemesis' of all the films - Shinzon. He's pretty much getting to be second-only to Gul Dukat as a ST 'villain' in my book.

Anyway, I'll post more on this later. But I was wondering if anyone else has had the same experience with this film? What do you enjoy about it now that eluded you on your first viewing?

Makeshift_Python

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POSTS: 563

Report this Sep. 05 2009, 12:15 am

Er. Can't agree, especially on Shinzon. I don't even see him near Dukat. :question:

Admiral_BlackCat

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POSTS: 1048

Report this Sep. 05 2009, 12:20 am

Dukat and the Sisko had wonderful back and forth, tit for tat chemistry.
Picard and Shinzon lacked a bit of that chemistry.
Overall NEM is an enjoyable movie and had several unique moments.

Makeshift_Python

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POSTS: 563

Report this Sep. 05 2009, 12:23 am

I think making Shinzon a "Nemesis" as the title implies is sorta forced. Perhaps if he were more developed back in TNG maybe it would have been more effective. Like if it was a plot by Sela or something to spite Picard in some manner.

Cptkirkfan18

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POSTS: 706

Report this Sep. 05 2009, 12:40 am

maybe for a better Nemesis... it could have been the Ferengi from the Battle of Maxia.  he was a nemesis cause Picard accidently killed his son.

Makeshift_Python

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POSTS: 563

Report this Sep. 05 2009, 1:11 am

Sela coulda been the nemesis. Makes perfect sense. She blames all of her toubles on the man who sent her mother back in time to die.

Cptkirkfan18

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POSTS: 706

Report this Sep. 05 2009, 1:21 am

i have to disagree, Monty Python. ¿plus it would be impossible since Sela was killed on an episode of DS9.

also i think Ben Sisko should have been a Nemesis, cause he blames Picard for the death of his wife... or even Captain Kirk?

Makeshift_Python

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POSTS: 563

Report this Sep. 05 2009, 1:23 am

Sela was last scene unconcious by a nerve punch on TNG's "Unification, Part II", she never made an appearance after that, especially on DS9.

And why would Sisko go after Picard? At the end of "Emissary" he finally got over the death of his wife with the help of the Prophets. It's especially evident in the scene where he meets Picard again and no longer holds a grudge.

Cptkirkfan18

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POSTS: 706

Report this Sep. 05 2009, 1:24 am

wrong.  Sela happened to be on a Warbird in DS9 during the Dominion War and the Warbird destroyed killing all hands including Sela.

Makeshift_Python

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POSTS: 563

Report this Sep. 05 2009, 1:26 am

Quote (Cptkirkfan18 @ Sep. 04 2009, 10:24 pm)
wrong. ¿Sela happened to be on a Warbird in DS9 during the Dominion War and the Warbird destroyed killing all hands including Sela.

That's pure speculation on your part.

Cptkirkfan18

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POSTS: 706

Report this Sep. 05 2009, 1:27 am

It is true.  look it up yourself, Monty

Makeshift_Python

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POSTS: 563

Report this Sep. 05 2009, 1:30 am

Quote (Cptkirkfan18 @ Sep. 04 2009, 10:27 pm)
It is true. ¿look it up yourself, Monty

I've recently watched DS9 a few weeks ago and at no point is Sela even brought up in any form.

Captain_Storma

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POSTS: 11836

Report this Sep. 05 2009, 11:15 am

I love this movie and simply cannot understand people who bash it for the sake of bashing it.

It has a wonderful story, the best SFX of all films and many lines of great dialogue.
One of my favorite TREK films.

DammitJim6200

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POSTS: 6876

Report this Sep. 05 2009, 11:16 am

Quote (Thyla @ Sep. 04 2009, 12:31 am)
Like many people, I walked away from ST:N very disappointed. However, as time passes, it keeps getting stronger for me, not only as a ST movie, but as a film in its own right. While I do believe that the film would have been strengthened by the inclusion of much of the cut material - and possibly by having had Frakes as director instead of Baird - the fact is, I keep finding more to like in it. I've seen it four times now - three of those viewings in the past year, the last one a week ago with a friend who had never watched it before. We talked for an hour about the film, and our discussion was ended only because I had to leave. I'd say that ST:N is the most openly cerebral of the ST movies after the original film. And it certainly has my favorite 'nemesis' of all the films - Shinzon. He's pretty much getting to be second-only to Gul Dukat as a ST 'villain' in my book.

Anyway, I'll post more on this later. But I was wondering if anyone else has had the same experience with this film? What do you enjoy about it now that eluded you on your first viewing?

I have, Nemesis is actually a pretty good film, inspite of some minor flaws, it had good action, I think a better actor playing Shinzon would had improve the movie more, Tom Hardy just don't have it.

Captain_Storma

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 11836

Report this Sep. 05 2009, 11:20 am

Quote (DammitJim6200 @ Sep. 05 2009, 8:16 pm)
Quote (Thyla @ Sep. 04 2009, 12:31 am)
Like many people, I walked away from ST:N very disappointed. However, as time passes, it keeps getting stronger for me, not only as a ST movie, but as a film in its own right. While I do believe that the film would have been strengthened by the inclusion of much of the cut material - and possibly by having had Frakes as director instead of Baird - the fact is, I keep finding more to like in it. I've seen it four times now - three of those viewings in the past year, the last one a week ago with a friend who had never watched it before. We talked for an hour about the film, and our discussion was ended only because I had to leave. I'd say that ST:N is the most openly cerebral of the ST movies after the original film. And it certainly has my favorite 'nemesis' of all the films - Shinzon. He's pretty much getting to be second-only to Gul Dukat as a ST 'villain' in my book.

Anyway, I'll post more on this later. But I was wondering if anyone else has had the same experience with this film? What do you enjoy about it now that eluded you on your first viewing?

I have, Nemesis is actually a pretty good film, inspite of some minor flaws, it had good action, I think a better actor playing Shinzon would had improve the movie more, Tom Hardy just don't have it.

Jude Law was in talks for that part, but refused since he had already signed for SKY CAPTAIN and ALFIE at that time.  :)

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