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Restoring the timeline when J.J.'s done...

Vger23

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 6799

Report this Aug. 07 2010, 9:22 pm

Quote: /view_profile/ @

Vger, I've seen this happen time and again on the lod boards, what would make me believe it will be any different here.

BTW: You just demonstrated exactly what I was talking about. You could have ignored what I said, or deflected it without making a personal attack. You didn't.



Aren't you the one that made the original statement...out of nowhere and for no reason?

All I said in response to your post was (essentially) that you'd be a lot better off minding your own business...and I'll stick to that statement. If you don't want to get engaged in horrible, pointless fights with mean-spirited confrontational people like horrible me...then why stick your fingers in the fire? If you hadn't said anything, I would never have addressed you.

Believe me, you're one of the last persons on the board I want to spend any time conversing with.

I AM KEE-ROCK!!

Tureaz'47

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2605

Report this Aug. 07 2010, 10:29 pm

It would be a mistake for the ST. franchise to move to far from the original timeline.
JJ. has his own ideas about ST. but I saw a lack of respect with the integrity of the dialogue. ST. has very high standards when it comes to it's characters and straying away from it's original intent will damage it's reputation. Who wants to be lost in "Lost"? That will certainly happen if it's dialogue lacks moral integrity. That's what sets it apart from other Sci-fi films and has contributed to it's longevity. That will continue unless they take it away from it's original intent. If JJ. doesn't understand or respect that then he may as well pass the baton onto a director who does like Jim Cameron perhaps. Although I thought ST.2009 was entertaining, it lacked detail and drama. It's important CBS preserve those aspects about it. That will ensure that it survives intact.
The timeline will have to be corrected at some stage to avoid confusion.

That's my 2 cents worth again. LOL!

It's strange, being a catalyst for things that move outside.

Vger23

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 6799

Report this Aug. 08 2010, 1:59 pm

Quote: /view_profile/ @

Re: ZeroArmour, Aug. 07 2010, 8:53 pm PT "If you look over a few of the posts below, you'll notice the usual pro & anti STXI people are gathering. This will lead to a bitter fight (always has before) where no one will listen to anyone else (hence pointless)." What I see is other folks giving their opinions and pointing out known quantities in a discussion and you maintaining a closed mind by continuing to make such comments as, "As for you and me, what point is there in my continuing a discussion with someone who argues that there are no "facts" but they are right?" It is a continuation of what you said earlier: ZeroArmour @ Aug. 05 2010, 9:04 pm "Trekbuff: If no one "knows" anything, then how can you be right?" Well, ZA. That is what I see as part of the problem. I have given many "facts" using what we have all been able to see in historic Trek and in STXT. It is a "fact" that time travel and parallel universes are only theoretical. It is a "fact" that bubble universes created by time travel is only a fringe theory pondered by some, especially Michio Kaku, to evade the possible paradoxes of time travel. It is a "fact" that time travel has never created a parallel universe in Trek productons before STXI and I saw no evidence for it in that production. It is a "fact" that, as presented, STXI is similar to Yesterday's Enterprise and City on the Edge of Forever. It is a "fact" that Yesterday's Enterprise was mentioned by Orci and Kurtzman as part of the source inspiration for their script of STXI. It is a "fact" that nothing was seen in STXI to even hint to any similarity to the TNG episode Parallels. It was only after fans were given hints that Trek history would be changed/altered/rebooted that there was any mention of Parallels by Orci in that confusing and condescending interview. Orci himself said that our DVDs would not disappear for that is where historic Trek continues to exist - our DVDs and our memories. Here's the link for Orci's bizarre, misinformed and condescending interview: http://trekmovie.com/2008/12/11/bob-orci-explains-how-the-new-star-trek-movie-fits-with-trek-canon-and-real-science/ My opinion is founded in what I know and why I have seen and heard in historic Trek and STXI. What gets me going is when someone tells someone else their opinion is wrong and only their opinion is the correct one. If someone uses the "facts" to formulate a different opinion, that's great and I may learn from them and change my mind. However, using imagination and the fear that historic Trek is no more to color those facts may be a basis for fun discussion, but it is no basis for argument or telling someone else they are wrong. I became involved because I found credence with much sylvantine had to say. I made a post to you because you found some as yet unknown justification to tell sylvantine they were "very wrong" (Aug. 04 2010, 9:42 pm). Most of what sylvantine said was opinion, but was historically valid conjecture or what I felt were common sense conclusions. My post to you was congenial and in no way an attack. I can get into discussions with Vger23 and a few others and yet other folks wonder when it will come to insults and verbal blows. I truly believe there is such a thing as a mainstream Trek fan (the 80% I pondered earlier) while Vger23 evidently does not. He stated of Enterprise, "I watched about 17 episodes before I made a fair assessment that this series did not interest me." While he was evaluating the series, the ratings took hits after every single episode pertaining to the Temporal Cold War. Vger23 commented of the TCW, "Also, I don't know what a TCW arc is with regard to "ENT." Of course, I also didn't complain and whine about it endlessly, but that's a different story!" I could get all upset, take it personal and claim Vger23 is attacking me because it is my opinion, conclusion actually, from the many comments made on the boards while the series was originally airing and from the ratings that show the TCW very much hurt the series' popularity. I could take it personally because I usually mention the TCW and the Xindi arcs when discussions of why the series only lasted four seasons come up. But... I know that Vger23 is an ardent Trek fan. Vger23 knows much of the history of Trek, its writers, its evolution and I would be foolish to argue his knowledge and especially his fandom. I chose my board name because I, also, am an ardent fan of the saga. It would be childish to debate who is more the fan of Trek. Vger23 is the fan he is and I am the fan I am. Vger23, evidently, did not watch every premier episode of ENT while I did. I dare say Vger23 liked STXI more than I did. I dare say I could come up with a scenario for both ENT and STXI which we would both enjoy because I believe in that 80%. What we all need to understand is, as Vger23 points out, there are probably no two Trek fans who will agree on everything pertaining to the saga and what they want to see from the next production, be it Enterprise when it aired, STXI or STXII. Vger23 and I hardly agree on everything, but we can discuss what we may disagree on. It would be unthinkable for me to tell him his opinion is wrong. As for the peanut gallery who actually seem to gain joy simply from stirring up trouble, Vger23 chose to address one, yet, so far, no one has chosen to address the other. It's too interesting to watch them flail in their own juices. Try to ignore the combative baiters and trolls, what these boards call "Phishing." There is no way to win simply because those people aren't here to discuss anything. Forgive spelling errors or typos. I tried... ;)


Very nice post, TB. I think this is one of the more fair and accurate assessments of how a well-handled debate should proceed that I've read.

To clarify on a few points you mentioned:

-Now that you've specified, I AM familliar with the "Temporal Cold War"...I just didn't recognize the acronym!

-I didn't DISLIKE Enterprise...nor did I give up on it entirely. I just didn't follow it nearly as devoutly as I had the other stuff. It was stil better than MOST of what was on the television at the time! I saw enough of it to keep up in general with what was going on.

-I was ABSOLUTELY NOT referring to you when I mentioned "constant whining." There is a difference between well-reasoned objections (which is typically what you display) and nit-picky whining. Whether you and I agree on everything or not is totally irrelevant and has no bearing on the level of respect I have for you. Conversely, just because someone happens to AGREE with me doesn't necessarily mean they are free from my considering them a buffoon either!


I AM KEE-ROCK!!

cbender50

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 1

Report this Nov. 10 2010, 9:03 pm

I feel that we should let JJ work through his timeline and see how it develops before we denounce it and if it draws new fans to the older stuff then itll help Star Trek into a new generation of fans

jamesspock1

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 461

Report this Nov. 13 2010, 11:30 am

Even though JJ has screwed up his universe, maybe, very slim chance, if we get a new series
that it will be created in the prime universe, and keep JJ's to his own, mind you I think my wish is only a dream.

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