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Star Trek TMP

MrsStarbuck

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POSTS: 4329

Report this Aug. 16 2009, 8:10 am

Okay, so I cheated. My lovely sister bought me TMP as a present, and although I really should have waited until I'd finished the series, I just couldn't. Considering how much fans seem to disparage this film, I wasn't expecting it to be that great, but it's amazing! I really don't understand why people don't like it.

Firstly, I should say that I saw the Directors Cut. I don't know if that will be why I liked it so much (how different is it to the theatrical version?)

Secondly, this is the first TOS film I've seen, so possibly it's just the excitement of seeing Kirk and co get the 'big screen' treatment that made me love it so much.

Thirdly, this is quite shameful to admit, but I've never seen 2001, so if there are comparisons to be made between this film and that one, I won't have got them.


So, onto the film. I thought it was beautifully composed. There are a lot of long, lingering shots of space (which I believe is one of the criticisms?) but I thought each and every one was quite breathtaking, especially when underpinned by Jerry Goldsmith's wonderful score.
The sweep past the Enterprise in dock was long, but fantastic. You could see in Kirk's eyes how happy and emotional he was to be back with his ship, and the views of the ship itself just strengthened this. It's also a lovely moment when he first steps into the turbolift and softly says "Bridge".
The V'Ger energy cloud was also quite fantastic to look at.
I really wish I'd seen this at the cinema!

I loved the whole concept of V'Ger, and I have to admit I got goosebumps when they realised it was a Voyager probe. It's a dilemma that surely touches each and every one of us at some point in our lives, why are we here etc...and in a way it felt almost slightly reassuring to think that the need for purpose isn't simply a human obsession, but one that every living thing strives for.

The early scenes on the Enterprise, when the crew all come back together, were wonderful. After a ten year drought, that must have been a truly magical moment for those of you who saw it at the time. It was great to see Rand back (even though she doesn't get to do much) and on the whole I really liked the more mature crew.
Kirk seems to have a calmness and dignity in his maturity that he didn't always have in the series. He seems much wiser and more centered, more contemplative, not as quick to action.

Spock I suppose has the biggest journey in the film. When he first came onto the Enterprise, and was cold and completely emotionless, it made me feel so sad (the scene where McCoy tries to joke with him and he doesn't respond is heartbreaking). In a way, V'Ger's state of consciousness mirrors Spock's, and it was wonderful to see him finally realise that emotions and feelings CAN have a purpose. The 'this simple feeling' scene is beautiful, I had a lump in my throat. Also, the moment on the bridge near the end, when Spock turns round and you see that he's crying, I had a tear in my eye at that.

A few superficial points: I like Spock's long-haired look, very nice. Not too sure about the new uniforms, especially the flesh coloured ones. And what the heck was McCoy wearing when he first arrived on the ship (medallion and chest hair?). He looked like he'd stepped off the set of Saturday Night Fever.

I like the new look of the Enterprise, some of the details of engineering in particular were stunning, and looked more like you'd imagine the workings of a starship to look than what they had on TOS (not knocking TOS, it's all about budget I know).

So on the whole I thought this film was wonderful, thought provoking and utterly engaging.

MrsStarbuck

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POSTS: 4329

Report this Aug. 16 2009, 8:30 am

Sorry, I just realised...I really should have put this on the movies board shouldn't I...

:blush:

Mirrorgirl

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Report this Aug. 16 2009, 9:09 am

Quote (MrsStarbuck @ Aug. 16 2009, 10:30 pm)
Sorry, I just realised...I really should have put this on the movies board shouldn't I...

:blush:

No I think it's valid to discuss it here on the TOS boards, it is very much an original series movie and I agree I love it, and I never even bother entering into discussion about the pros and cons; you either love it or you dis-like it, there's not much middle ground as far as I can tell with movie.

I love it's ideas and the acting (the uniforms can be distracting, but I try to look past that.

Vice_Adm_Baxter

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Report this Aug. 16 2009, 9:46 am

Quote (Yanks @ Aug. 16 2009, 6:37 am)
The only problem I had with TMP was it's length. Many scenes drawn out...

She had seen the Directors Cut which fixed all of those problems plus a few minor ones.

TMP is easily the best TOS film by far in almost every aspect.

lostshaker

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POSTS: 2293

Report this Aug. 16 2009, 9:56 am

Wasn't born yet for the theatrical release, but I have the original release on VHS, the extended additional version of VHS, and also the Director's addition. I LOVE this movie in all its incarnations and it's by far the best of all the movies.

Now I haven't seen the VHS in a long while now because I don't have a VCR anymore, but I'll paint a picture of the differences. First, the ones that don't like the movie tend to consider it slow and boring and favor the likes of TWOK - which ranks at the lower end on my list though I still consider it to be good.

Second, the original editing was mismanaged because of time constraints and Paramount rushing it. I've heard they only had two weeks to edit the original release. So, there were scenes that were roughly cut like Sovak's and so the transporter accident didn't make sense since very little context was given.

Another scene was Kirk's exit of the ENT in a spacesuit to go after Spock. A larger shot revealed the wooden support/construction beams holding up the set. They were supposed to go into the film and paint over the wood, but there wasn't enough time, so large random wooden beams appeared as part of the ENT hull thirty feet tall on a movie screen. There were apparently a lot of things like that. The director was described to be cringing in embarrassment when the film premiered, but Roddenberry in contrast was delighted with the movie - and good for him I say. Again, I love this movie in all its forms.

The extended edition of the film put in a lot of scenes that explained different story lines and so the movie made more sense.

The Director's Cut is epic. The day it came out I went around town for half the day trying to find TMP. It was my first DVD and so subsequently my first DVD player was bought that day too.

MrSpock44

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Report this Aug. 16 2009, 4:33 pm

I think TWoK is the best Trek movie, but I like TMP alot.  I like the mood of it.  I definately think the Director's Cut is an improvement over the different longer versions.  Nothing truly "important" was cut (although I did think some of the cut scenes were nice), and the movie overall seemed to flow much more smoothly.  I think this movie is really the only "hard sci-fi" movie of the bunch.

 This isn't to say that the movie is without it's faults.  I think it's a beautifully composed movie, but sometimes I was expecting just a little "more".  That's why I like the Director's Cut better, the movie flows a little faster.  Don't get me wrong, I have absolutely nothing against movies with a slow pace (the first few space scenes in TMP are beautiful), as long as something is being accomplished.  At some points I felt that the slower moments were just for the sake of showing off a bigger budget and didn't really advance any of the "ideas" of the film.  This is a relatively minor criticism though, especially for the Director's Cut.

 Also, I just have to say something about the music.  The music in the Star Trek movies is almost always one of the strong points, even the weaker movies have great music.  Goldsmith was just SO good, and the music in The Wrath of Khan and The Search for Spock are two of Horner's better scores as well imo.  The score in the new movie may be the only Trek score I didn't really care for.

 I know some Trek fans like to criticize the Star Trek movies (nobody here, but I know some fans who really dislike the movies and bash them mercilessly as subpar sci-fi films), but honestly I think they're all great to watch, especially the first six.  I have a feeling you'll enjoy all of them (well, Star Trek V may be the exception, but it may not, we'll see).

Renaikan

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Report this Aug. 16 2009, 4:35 pm

Noticable change you will see in the Director's cut is the Vulcan daytime sky. Original had the stars showing, director's cut didn't.

The movie was ok. It seemed the movie was more special affects driven then story driven. Too many long scenes showing the enterprise, V-Ger, etc... The costumes were awful, and they tried to make all the actors look much younger through heavy makeup. The characters too seemed shallow compared to the TV series.

What I liked about the movie. Seeing the old crew back and on the bigscreen after a 10 year layoff was a thrill.

MrsStarbuck

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POSTS: 4329

Report this Aug. 16 2009, 6:47 pm

Quote (lostshaker @ Aug. 15 2009, 3:56 pm)

Now I haven't seen the VHS in a long while now because I don't have a VCR anymore, but I'll paint a picture of the differences. First, the ones that don't like the movie tend to consider it slow and boring and favor the likes of TWOK - which ranks at the lower end on my list though I still consider it to be good.


See, maybe I'll change my mind when I see TWOK and see how fact paced and action-ey it is...but in a way I like the idea that each Trek film is a different kind of film from the rest. For me, I didn't see the pace of this film as 'slow' but as thought-provoking. They threw some awesome concepts at you, but then gave you the time to truly take them in, instead of simply rushing forward to the next action-packed scene.

Quote (lostshaker @ Aug. 15 2009, 3:56 pm)

Second, the original editing was mismanaged because of time constraints and Paramount rushing it. I've heard they only had two weeks to edit the original release. So, there were scenes that were roughly cut like Sovak's and so the transporter accident didn't make sense since very little context was given.

Another scene was Kirk's exit of the ENT in a spacesuit to go after Spock. A larger shot revealed the wooden support/construction beams holding up the set. They were supposed to go into the film and paint over the wood, but there wasn't enough time, so large random wooden beams appeared as part of the ENT hull thirty feet tall on a movie screen. There were apparently a lot of things like that. The director was described to be cringing in embarrassment when the film premiered, but Roddenberry in contrast was delighted with the movie - and good for him I say.


Hmm...remind me who Sovak was again...

I can see how some of those things might be distracting (the wooden platform for sure)...but then again, no offense but surely TOS fans are used to sets that look a bit...erm...I don't want to say cheesy...:laugh:

(Only joking!;)

Quote (lostshaker @ Aug. 15 2009, 3:56 pm)

The Director's Cut is epic. The day it came out I went around town for half the day trying to find TMP. It was my first DVD and so subsequently my first DVD player was bought that day too.


Aw, I'm so glad that others love it this much too. I don't know why I got the impression that most TOS fans hated it.

MrsStarbuck

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POSTS: 4329

Report this Aug. 16 2009, 6:52 pm

Quote (MrSpock44 @ Aug. 15 2009, 10:33 pm)
Also, I just have to say something about the music. ¿The music in the Star Trek movies is almost always one of the strong points, even the weaker movies have great music. ¿Goldsmith was just SO good, and the music in The Wrath of Khan and The Search for Spock are two of Horner's better scores as well imo. ¿The score in the new movie may be the only Trek score I didn't really care for.


I don't know if this is only a feature of the DVD I had, but before the film starts (like, before you see the Paramount logo), there's a good few minutes where it just shows a starfield, and the score over that is amazing.

Quote (MrSpock44 @ Aug. 15 2009, 10:33 pm)

I know some Trek fans like to criticize the Star Trek movies (nobody here, but I know some fans who really dislike the movies and bash them mercilessly as subpar sci-fi films), but honestly I think they're all great to watch, especially the first six.  I have a feeling you'll enjoy all of them (well, Star Trek V may be the exception, but it may not, we'll see).


I'm really looking forward to seeing the others now, although I DO like the science in this one, and I'm not sure if I'll miss the fact that it doesn't feature so prominently in the others.

WarDancer

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POSTS: 160

Report this Aug. 16 2009, 7:02 pm

Yo

One d**m minute Mrs. Starbuck.  I assure you,  you will love them all but you will laugh and laugh and feel renewed when you watch The Voyage Home.

It brings it all together again...what was lost was found.

And listening to Spock try out some colorful metaphors really gave me the giggles.  

Well my opening line to you was one of my favorites of Spock's in the movie.   He finally "got it".

WarDancer

MrsStarbuck

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Report this Aug. 16 2009, 7:03 pm

Quote (Renaikan @ Aug. 15 2009, 10:35 pm)
The characters too seemed shallow compared to the TV series.

Do you think so? I'll admit, I think they presumed that the audience would know something about the characters already going into the film (the close relationships between Kirk, Spock and McCoy are taken for granted for example).

But I think Spock especially had some fantastic development in this film, going from wanting to purge himself of all emotion, to finally realising that he does have a need for feelings and emotions, and that to make that connection with others is possibly the most important reason that we're here.

Kirk seemed more restrained, but I took that to be a sign of maturity, rather than him being shallow. He did also have some truly beautiful moments...seeing the Enterprise for the first time, seeing Spock for the first time...

I think I liked Kirk more in this film, he was a much more confident (as opposed to coc-ky) Captain, and his love for his ship and his crew really shone through.


In fact, while I'm talking about Kirk...some of my favourite moments of his were:

- That wink that he gives Chekov when they achieve warp speed *melts*
- The speech he gives to Decker about 'boldy going' and having the courage to venture into unknown territory.
- And of course the 'this simple feeling' scene.

MrsStarbuck

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POSTS: 4329

Report this Aug. 16 2009, 7:07 pm

Quote (WarDancer @ Aug. 16 2009, 1:02 am)
Yo

One d**m minute Mrs. Starbuck. ¿I assure you, ¿you will love them all but you will laugh and laugh and feel renewed when you watch The Voyage Home.

It brings it all together again...what was lost was found.

And listening to Spock try out some colorful metaphors really gave me the giggles. ¿

Well my opening line to you was one of my favorites of Spock's in the movie. ¿ He finally "got it".

WarDancer

Spock says 'd**m' ?!

...fascinating!

I'm looking forward to all of them War Dancer. Finding out how wonderful TMP is has taught me to have no preconceptions of what other fans thought of the films going into them...

Mirrorgirl

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POSTS: 15692

Report this Aug. 16 2009, 8:10 pm

Just by the by, there is a classic structure to the first four movies, that I just love, and The Voyage Home rounds out the structure being a light-heart romp/farce (albeit it one with a powerful message) and brings comic relief after drama and tragedy and romance of the first three film...just another area where Star Trek gets it SO right.

Mrs Starbuck, enjoy watching them for the first time, I truly envy you the next couple of months of discovery and wonder and laghter and tears...all I can say is squeeeeeeeeeeee :D

CommodoreSchmidlapp

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POSTS: 9470

Report this Aug. 17 2009, 3:13 am

TMP iz da bomb, especially the Director's Cut. Those who know me know I've been saying this fer many years. If you lack in attention span, then I'm sorry, resume yer video game or Twitter feed.

:rookie:

CommodoreSchmidlapp

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Report this Aug. 17 2009, 5:12 am

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