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Book Canon

1701TheOriginal

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POSTS: 607

Report this Aug. 10 2009, 10:21 pm

From my Borg thread on the movie boards, regarding the Destiny Trilogy, I had another thought.

Ever since Star Trek XI came out, the idea of the Prime Universe being revisited on-screen is highly unlikely because of the new fan base established. So, does this now mean that the books can be considered canon? And simply not any books, but those published primarily after the series finale of Enterprise?

Would it hurt for this to happen? Since nothing on-screen will contradict it and nothing more will be explored on-screen, it should be okay...or will it?

Captain_Storma

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POSTS: 11836

Report this Aug. 11 2009, 7:24 am

Quote (1701TheOriginal @ Aug. 11 2009, 7:21 am)
From my Borg thread on the movie boards, regarding the Destiny Trilogy, I had another thought.

Ever since Star Trek XI came out, the idea of the Prime Universe being revisited on-screen is highly unlikely because of the new fan base established. So, does this now mean that the books can be considered canon? And simply not any books, but those published primarily after the series finale of Enterprise?

Would it hurt for this to happen? Since nothing on-screen will contradict it and nothing more will be explored on-screen, it should be okay...or will it?

It would not hurt... and as long as we do not see anything that differes from the events which happen in the book (which are quite spectacular), I think it is the official timeline.

Of course you could argue that STAR TREK ONLINE and COUNTDOWN can also be taken as official, yes they are, but what is more likely?

A conflict between Klingons and the Federation or the Typhon Pact scenario?

Especially after the Dominion War (canon) and the Borg Invasion (official), the Klingons and the Federation would form an alliance which one day will lead into Klingon membership.

This makes STO very unlikely.

Thanks God the authors of the books do not regard the "path to 2409" as official and are establishing their own, much more logical and coherent timeline.

In the end, you decide. For me, the books are as canon as the movies and TV shows.

TheDriver

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POSTS: 1652

Report this Aug. 11 2009, 7:28 am

Canon = what we've seen onscreen.

That's it. Everything else is just "pretend."

frimmel

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Report this Aug. 11 2009, 11:14 am

It only matters to those reading the books and as long as they continue to maintain the internal consistency within and across series they've demonstrated lately I'll continue to read them.

What I fear is that the publishing arm will come under pressure to devote all their resources to the JJverse and that all the best authors will 'jump ship' to cash in on the popularity.

Captain_Storma

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POSTS: 11836

Report this Aug. 11 2009, 12:01 pm

Quote (frimmel @ Aug. 11 2009, 8:14 pm)
It only matters to those reading the books and as long as they continue to maintain the internal consistency within and across series they've demonstrated lately I'll continue to read them.

What I fear is that the publishing arm will come under pressure to devote all their resources to the JJverse and that all the best authors will 'jump ship' to cash in on the popularity.

I hope they won't since all books set in the JJverse lose their right to exist when the sequel is released.

captainroe

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POSTS: 5254

Report this Aug. 11 2009, 12:03 pm

After reading the last batch of ST books, especially Before Dishonor and now that I'm reading the Destiny trilogy I now see why people don't consider the books to be canon. Authors are now taking way too many liberties and it's just messing things up. Regarding the movie, I haven't seen it yet so I can't say. But isn't it an alternate timeline anyways? So what difference would it make?

Captain_Storma

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Report this Aug. 11 2009, 1:44 pm

"Before dishonor" let aside (it was a horrible book).

I wish TREK on screen would take the risks and changes Mr. Mack presented in his terrific DESTINY trilogy.

Yet it is always (even now) the same formula.

I thought the new universe was there to give them liberties they would not have in the original one... so they blew up Vulcan... yeah great. What about killing of main characters? Now that would be interesting. TOS without Spock, without Kirk. That would face a challange. Yet we will see nothing of that sort.

TageRyche

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POSTS: 133

Report this Aug. 12 2009, 6:03 pm

Quote (Captain_Storma @ Aug. 11 2009, 12:01 pm)
Quote (frimmel @ Aug. 11 2009, 8:14 pm)
It only matters to those reading the books and as long as they continue to maintain the internal consistency within and across series they've demonstrated lately I'll continue to read them.

What I fear is that the publishing arm will come under pressure to devote all their resources to the JJverse and that all the best authors will 'jump ship' to cash in on the popularity.

I hope they won't since all books set in the JJverse lose their right to exist when the sequel is released.

And the authors would all have to figure out how to cram a giant red ball into their stories.

TageRyche

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POSTS: 133

Report this Aug. 12 2009, 6:04 pm

Two separate things for me.

The books are the Real Star Trek Universe.

The new movie is the wankfest for people too lazy to learn the history of Star Trek and are satisfied with a half-ass albeit excitingly paced script.

captbates

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POSTS: 12614

Report this Aug. 12 2009, 6:08 pm

Quote (starbase63 @ Aug. 10 2009, 1:02 pm)
Quote (1701TheOriginal @ Aug. 10 2009, 10:21 pm)
From my Borg thread on the movie boards, regarding the Destiny Trilogy, I had another thought.

Ever since Star Trek XI came out, the idea of the Prime Universe being revisited on-screen is highly unlikely because of the new fan base established. So, does this now mean that the books can be considered canon? And simply not any books, but those published primarily after the series finale of Enterprise?

Would it hurt for this to happen? Since nothing on-screen will contradict it and nothing more will be explored on-screen, it should be okay...or will it?

All together now...

There are now two separate timelines.

The one the new movie takes place in (owned by Paramount)

And the one all other Trek takes place in (owned by CBS)

Both exist.

There has been absolutely NO announcement from CBS that there will be no further Trek in the Prime timeline.

Therefore, even though they're non-canon, any books from prior to the release of STXI are not affected in any way.

:logical:

SB, I swear you must have an early warning RADAR for these threads, Lol



I just don't know why so many people don't understand there are two timelines  :O

Vice_Adm_Baxter

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POSTS: 0

Report this Aug. 12 2009, 6:44 pm

Quote (captbates @ Aug. 12 2009, 3:08 pm)
Quote (starbase63 @ Aug. 10 2009, 1:02 pm)
Quote (1701TheOriginal @ Aug. 10 2009, 10:21 pm)
From my Borg thread on the movie boards, regarding the Destiny Trilogy, I had another thought.

Ever since Star Trek XI came out, the idea of the Prime Universe being revisited on-screen is highly unlikely because of the new fan base established. So, does this now mean that the books can be considered canon? And simply not any books, but those published primarily after the series finale of Enterprise?

Would it hurt for this to happen? Since nothing on-screen will contradict it and nothing more will be explored on-screen, it should be okay...or will it?

All together now...

There are now two separate timelines.

The one the new movie takes place in (owned by Paramount)

And the one all other Trek takes place in (owned by CBS)

Both exist.

There has been absolutely NO announcement from CBS that there will be no further Trek in the Prime timeline.

Therefore, even though they're non-canon, any books from prior to the release of STXI are not affected in any way.

:logical:

SB, I swear you must have an early warning RADAR for these threads, Lol



I just don't know why so many people don't understand there are two timelines ¿:O

It's called denial. That's why they dont get it.

1701TheOriginal

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 607

Report this Aug. 13 2009, 1:57 am

Quote (Vice_Adm_Baxter @ Aug. 12 2009, 5:44 pm)
Quote (captbates @ Aug. 12 2009, 3:08 pm)
Quote (starbase63 @ Aug. 10 2009, 1:02 pm)
Quote (1701TheOriginal @ Aug. 10 2009, 10:21 pm)
From my Borg thread on the movie boards, regarding the Destiny Trilogy, I had another thought.

Ever since Star Trek XI came out, the idea of the Prime Universe being revisited on-screen is highly unlikely because of the new fan base established. So, does this now mean that the books can be considered canon? And simply not any books, but those published primarily after the series finale of Enterprise?

Would it hurt for this to happen? Since nothing on-screen will contradict it and nothing more will be explored on-screen, it should be okay...or will it?

All together now...

There are now two separate timelines.

The one the new movie takes place in (owned by Paramount)

And the one all other Trek takes place in (owned by CBS)

Both exist.

There has been absolutely NO announcement from CBS that there will be no further Trek in the Prime timeline.

Therefore, even though they're non-canon, any books from prior to the release of STXI are not affected in any way.

:logical:

SB, I swear you must have an early warning RADAR for these threads, Lol



I just don't know why so many people don't understand there are two timelines ?:O

It's called denial. That's why they dont get it.

Now now, boys, I am not denying this at all, I agree with you entirely!

mrchallenge

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POSTS: 65

Report this Aug. 13 2009, 10:23 am

Okay I understand how there are now too timelines but doesn't the destruction of Romulus in 2387 also take place in the prime universe or is that simply just the "paramount" timeline?

In the prime (CBS) timeline the romulus destruction doesn't happen?

captbates

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POSTS: 12614

Report this Aug. 13 2009, 10:53 am

Quote (mrchallenge @ Aug. 12 2009, 3:23 pm)
Okay I understand how there are now too timelines but doesn't the destruction of Romulus in 2387 also take place in the prime universe or is that simply just the "paramount" timeline?

In the prime (CBS) timeline the romulus destruction doesn't happen?

Romulus is destroyed in 2387, the events in NEM take place in 2379, so the Prime timeline, before XI, never reached that date. I'm sure that there must be some kind of understanding between Paramount and CBS that any "overlapping" of timelines would have to be dealt with consistantly, and that if Romulus is gone in XI that it must stay gone in any future TV show.

frimmel

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 350

Report this Aug. 13 2009, 11:06 am

Quote (1701TheOriginal @ Aug. 13 2009, 1:57 am)
Now now, boys, I am not denying this at all, I agree with you entirely!

I for one didn't think you did. Nor sure where all that uncalled for 'there are two timelines, idiot' came from. I've seen that in a few threads now.

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