ATTENTION: The Boards will be closed permanently on May 28th, 2014. Posting will be disabled on April 28th, 2014. More Info

Shouldn't we get rid of "in God we Trust"

akebono62

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 19767

Report this Jul. 27 2009, 12:13 pm

Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 9:08 am)
Quote (akebono62 @ July 27 2009, 11:47 am)
Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 8:39 am)
Quote (loveroftrekmen @ July 27 2009, 4:25 am)
Quote (PointFiveVulcan @ July 26 2009, 12:59 am)
The other founders besides Thomas Jefferson did found this nation with God in mind.

You are still free to believe what you want but its a Christian founded nation.

Absolutely untrue. We have discussed this on another thread or maybe this one, but history shows this nation was not founded on Christianity. In fact, the phrase was added much later. Nice try, but your wrong.

;)

Must not be a legitimate copy.

You know how those Christians twist and distort everything to suit their purpose!

:sarcastic:

"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded not by religionists but by Christians, not on religion but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. We shall not fight alone. God presides over the destinies of nations."

- Patrick Henry

;)

Good old Pat- never at a loss for words!

Alisium

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 8705

Report this Jul. 27 2009, 12:14 pm

Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 4:08 am)
Quote (akebono62 @ July 27 2009, 11:47 am)
Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 8:39 am)
Quote (loveroftrekmen @ July 27 2009, 4:25 am)
Quote (PointFiveVulcan @ July 26 2009, 12:59 am)
The other founders besides Thomas Jefferson did found this nation with God in mind.

You are still free to believe what you want but its a Christian founded nation.

Absolutely untrue. We have discussed this on another thread or maybe this one, but history shows this nation was not founded on Christianity. In fact, the phrase was added much later. Nice try, but your wrong.

;)

Must not be a legitimate copy.

You know how those Christians twist and distort everything to suit their purpose!

:sarcastic:

"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded not by religionists but by Christians, not on religion but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. We shall not fight alone. God presides over the destinies of nations."

- Patrick Henry

;)

But that's vague references to an unnamed and unspecific diety...err

Um

Nevermind.

WilburWood

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 21509

Report this Jul. 27 2009, 12:15 pm

Quote (Alisium @ July 27 2009, 12:14 pm)
Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 4:08 am)
Quote (akebono62 @ July 27 2009, 11:47 am)
Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 8:39 am)
Quote (loveroftrekmen @ July 27 2009, 4:25 am)
Quote (PointFiveVulcan @ July 26 2009, 12:59 am)
The other founders besides Thomas Jefferson did found this nation with God in mind.

You are still free to believe what you want but its a Christian founded nation.

Absolutely untrue. We have discussed this on another thread or maybe this one, but history shows this nation was not founded on Christianity. In fact, the phrase was added much later. Nice try, but your wrong.

;)

Must not be a legitimate copy.

You know how those Christians twist and distort everything to suit their purpose!

:sarcastic:

"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded not by religionists but by Christians, not on religion but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. We shall not fight alone. God presides over the destinies of nations."

- Patrick Henry

;)

But that's vague references to an unnamed and unspecific diety...err

Um

Nevermind.

:D

Longtimetrekker1

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 9471

Report this Jul. 27 2009, 12:18 pm

Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 12:15 pm)
Quote (Alisium @ July 27 2009, 12:14 pm)
Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 4:08 am)
Quote (akebono62 @ July 27 2009, 11:47 am)
Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 8:39 am)
Quote (loveroftrekmen @ July 27 2009, 4:25 am)
Quote (PointFiveVulcan @ July 26 2009, 12:59 am)
The other founders besides Thomas Jefferson did found this nation with God in mind.

You are still free to believe what you want but its a Christian founded nation.

Absolutely untrue. We have discussed this on another thread or maybe this one, but history shows this nation was not founded on Christianity. In fact, the phrase was added much later. Nice try, but your wrong.

;)

Must not be a legitimate copy.

You know how those Christians twist and distort everything to suit their purpose!

:sarcastic:

"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded not by religionists but by Christians, not on religion but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. We shall not fight alone. God presides over the destinies of nations."

- Patrick Henry

;)

But that's vague references to an unnamed and unspecific diety...err

Um

Nevermind.

:D

I do not find in orthodox Christianity one redeeming feature.
Thomas Jefferson  

:p

Longtimetrekker1

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 9471

Report this Jul. 27 2009, 12:23 pm

Quote (Alisium @ July 27 2009, 12:14 pm)
Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 4:08 am)
Quote (akebono62 @ July 27 2009, 11:47 am)
Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 8:39 am)
Quote (loveroftrekmen @ July 27 2009, 4:25 am)
Quote (PointFiveVulcan @ July 26 2009, 12:59 am)
The other founders besides Thomas Jefferson did found this nation with God in mind.

You are still free to believe what you want but its a Christian founded nation.

Absolutely untrue. We have discussed this on another thread or maybe this one, but history shows this nation was not founded on Christianity. In fact, the phrase was added much later. Nice try, but your wrong.

;)

Must not be a legitimate copy.

You know how those Christians twist and distort everything to suit their purpose!

:sarcastic:

"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded not by religionists but by Christians, not on religion but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. We shall not fight alone. God presides over the destinies of nations."

- Patrick Henry

;)

But that's vague references to an unnamed and unspecific diety...err

Um

Nevermind.

And Patrick Henry never rose higher than Governor of Virginia. ¿He rejected the Constitution at first, though he modified his views later. ¿He was offered various government posts by Washington and others but refused them all. ¿ He's not really someone you can go to for the intent of the framers of the Constitution, so his personal views are interesting, but not relevant to this discussion.

Alisium

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 8705

Report this Jul. 27 2009, 12:26 pm

Quote (Longtimetrekker1 @ July 27 2009, 4:18 am)
Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 12:15 pm)
Quote (Alisium @ July 27 2009, 12:14 pm)
Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 4:08 am)
Quote (akebono62 @ July 27 2009, 11:47 am)
Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 8:39 am)
Quote (loveroftrekmen @ July 27 2009, 4:25 am)
Quote (PointFiveVulcan @ July 26 2009, 12:59 am)
The other founders besides Thomas Jefferson did found this nation with God in mind.

You are still free to believe what you want but its a Christian founded nation.

Absolutely untrue. We have discussed this on another thread or maybe this one, but history shows this nation was not founded on Christianity. In fact, the phrase was added much later. Nice try, but your wrong.

;)

Must not be a legitimate copy.

You know how those Christians twist and distort everything to suit their purpose!

:sarcastic:

"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded not by religionists but by Christians, not on religion but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. We shall not fight alone. God presides over the destinies of nations."

- Patrick Henry

;)

But that's vague references to an unnamed and unspecific diety...err

Um

Nevermind.

:D

I do not find in orthodox Christianity one redeeming feature.
Thomas Jefferson ?

:p

Yet Jefferson was a deeply religous man. Just of his own design.

Intentional run-on sentence:

He was also a slave holder that ran enormous debts that never fought in any capacity yet felt that the liberty tree needed the blood of patriots and that we should have a little blood shedding revolution every generation or so and that the French Revolution, during it's worst, was a great thing and during his time in France, though a non-slave nation, kept his slaves at work, including the mother of his illegitimate children.

While people like John Adams were away from home for months and years for the purpose of the American cause, he would often go home to one of his several estates to take breaks.

Not the greatest of the founding fathers, IMHO.

The Quotable John Adams.

Quote
?The general principles upon which the Fathers achieved independence were the general principles of Christianity?I will avow that I believed and now believe that those general principles of Christianity are as eternal and immutable as the existence and the attributes of God.?
[June 28, 1813; Letter to Thomas Jefferson]

?We recognize no Sovereign but God, and no King but Jesus!?
[April 18, 1775, on the eve of the Revolutionary War after a British major ordered John Adams, John Han####, and those with them to disperse in ?the name of George the Sovereign King of England." ]

? ?[July 4th] ought to be commemorated as the day of deliverance by solemn acts of devotion to God Almighty.?
[letter written to Abigail on the day the Declaration was approved by Congress]

"We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Avarice, ambition, revenge, or gallantry, would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other." --October 11, 1798

"I have examined all religions, as well as my narrow sphere, my straightened means, and my busy life, would allow; and the result is that the Bible is the best Book in the world. It contains more philosophy than all the libraries I have seen." December 25, 1813 letter to Thomas Jefferson

"Without Religion this World would be Something not fit to be mentioned in polite Company, I mean Hell." [John Adams to Thomas Jefferson, April 19, 1817] ¿


And Adams was probably the hardest and most effective leader when it came to the government aspects of the Revolution.

President George Washington, September 17th, 1796 "It is impossible to rightly govern the world without God and the Bible"

Not saying that anyone wanted a state sponsored religion but the founders, for the most part, were Christians and that influenced their day to day lives and service to the nation.

akebono62

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 19767

Report this Jul. 27 2009, 12:27 pm

> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 12:15 pm)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (Alisium @ July 27 2009, 12:14 pm)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 4:08 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (akebono62 @ July 27 2009, 11:47 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 8:39 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (loveroftrekmen @ July 27 2009, 4:25 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (PointFiveVulcan @ July 26 2009, 12:59 am)> id="QUOTE">The other founders besides Thomas Jefferson did found this nation with God in mind.

You are still free to believe what you want but its a Christian founded nation.
border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (Longtimetrekker1 @ July 27 2009, 9:18 am)

Absolutely untrue. We have discussed this on another thread or maybe this one, but history shows this nation was not founded on Christianity. In fact, the phrase was added much later. Nice try, but your wrong.

:sarcastic:
"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded not by religionists but by Christians, not on religion but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. We shall not fight alone. God presides over the destinies of nations."

- Patrick Henry


But that's vague references to an unnamed and unspecific diety...err

Um

Nevermind.

I do not find in orthodox Christianity one redeeming feature.
Thomas Jefferson ?


Jefferson was a bit of a syncretist- partly from being so well-read.

:)

Plus, the ultimate meaning of that quote may hinge on how he defined "orthodox"-"Orthodox" or "orthodox"?

Longtimetrekker1

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 9471

Report this Jul. 27 2009, 12:32 pm

> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (Longtimetrekker1 @ July 27 2009, 9:18 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 12:15 pm)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (Alisium @ July 27 2009, 12:14 pm)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 4:08 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (akebono62 @ July 27 2009, 11:47 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 8:39 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (loveroftrekmen @ July 27 2009, 4:25 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (PointFiveVulcan @ July 26 2009, 12:59 am)> id="QUOTE">The other founders besides Thomas Jefferson did found this nation with God in mind.

You are still free to believe what you want but its a Christian founded nation.
border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (akebono62 @ July 27 2009, 12:27 pm)

Absolutely untrue. We have discussed this on another thread or maybe this one, but history shows this nation was not founded on Christianity. In fact, the phrase was added much later. Nice try, but your wrong.
:D
I do not find in orthodox Christianity one redeeming feature.
Thomas Jefferson ?


Jefferson was a bit of a syncretist- partly from being so well-read.

:)
Benjamin Franklin believed in God, but not in the divinity of Jesus. ¿I think his mellow, easy going view on religion is actually pretty interesting. ¿Most people just don't know what the founding fathers thought about religion. ¿ They take public statements to represent private beliefs, even though they were politicians and knew the difference between public and private positions. ¿ Anyway, Ben is quite honest here I think:

"You desire to know something of my religion. It is the first time I have been questioned upon it. But I cannot take your curiosity amiss, and shall endeavour in a few words to gratify it. Here is my creed. I believe in one God, Creator of the Universe. That He governs it by His providence. That He ought to be worshipped. That the most acceptable service we render Him is doing good to His other children. That the soul of man is immortal, and will be treated with justice in another life respecting its conduct in this. These I take to be the fundamental principles of all sound religion, and I regard them as you do in whatever sect I meet with them.
"As to Jesus of Nazareth, my opinion of whom you particularly desire, I think the system of Morals and his Religion, as he left them to us, the best the World ever saw or is likely to see; but I apprehend it has received various corrupt changes, and I have, with most of the present Dissenters in England, some doubts as to his divinity; though it is a question I do not dogmatize upon, having never studied it, and think it needless to busy myself with it, when I expect soon an opportunity of knowing the Truth with less trouble. I see no harm, however, in its being believed, if that belief has the good consequence, as probably it has, of making his doctrines more respected and better observed; especially as I do not perceive that the Supreme takes it amiss, by distinguishing the unbelievers in His government of the world with any particular marks of His displeasure."

WilburWood

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 21509

Report this Jul. 27 2009, 12:34 pm

> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (Longtimetrekker1 @ July 27 2009, 9:18 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 12:15 pm)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (Alisium @ July 27 2009, 12:14 pm)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 4:08 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (akebono62 @ July 27 2009, 11:47 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 8:39 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (loveroftrekmen @ July 27 2009, 4:25 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (PointFiveVulcan @ July 26 2009, 12:59 am)> id="QUOTE">The other founders besides Thomas Jefferson did found this nation with God in mind.

You are still free to believe what you want but its a Christian founded nation.
border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (akebono62 @ July 27 2009, 12:27 pm)

Absolutely untrue. We have discussed this on another thread or maybe this one, but history shows this nation was not founded on Christianity. In fact, the phrase was added much later. Nice try, but your wrong.
:sarcastic:
"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded not by religionists but by Christians, not on religion but on the Gospel of Jesus Christ. We shall not fight alone. God presides over the destinies of nations."

- Patrick Henry


But that's vague references to an unnamed and unspecific diety...err

Um

Nevermind.

I do not find in orthodox Christianity one redeeming feature.
Thomas Jefferson ?


Jefferson was a bit of a syncretist- partly from being so well-read.

:)

Plus, the ultimate meaning of that quote may hinge on how he defined "orthodox"-"Orthodox" or "orthodox"?
"Question with boldness even the existence of a god."

- Thomas Jefferson, letter to Peter Carr, 10 August 1787.

Does that answer your question? :D

akebono62

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 19767

Report this Jul. 27 2009, 12:37 pm

> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (akebono62 @ July 27 2009, 12:27 pm)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (Longtimetrekker1 @ July 27 2009, 9:18 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 12:15 pm)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (Alisium @ July 27 2009, 12:14 pm)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 4:08 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (akebono62 @ July 27 2009, 11:47 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 8:39 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (loveroftrekmen @ July 27 2009, 4:25 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (PointFiveVulcan @ July 26 2009, 12:59 am)> id="QUOTE">The other founders besides Thomas Jefferson did found this nation with God in mind.

You are still free to believe what you want but its a Christian founded nation.
border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (Longtimetrekker1 @ July 27 2009, 9:32 am)

Absolutely untrue. We have discussed this on another thread or maybe this one, but history shows this nation was not founded on Christianity. In fact, the phrase was added much later. Nice try, but your wrong.
:D
I do not find in orthodox Christianity one redeeming feature.
Thomas Jefferson ?


Jefferson was a bit of a syncretist- partly from being so well-read.

:)
Benjamin Franklin believed in God, but not in the divinity of Jesus. ?I think his mellow, easy going view on religion is actually pretty interesting. ?Most people just don't know what the founding fathers thought about religion. ? They take public statements to represent private beliefs, even though they were politicians and knew the difference between public and private positions. ? Anyway, Ben is quite honest here I think:

"You desire to know something of my religion. It is the first time I have been questioned upon it. But I cannot take your curiosity amiss, and shall endeavour in a few words to gratify it. Here is my creed. I believe in one God, Creator of the Universe. That He governs it by His providence. That He ought to be worshipped. That the most acceptable service we render Him is doing good to His other children. That the soul of man is immortal, and will be treated with justice in another life respecting its conduct in this. These I take to be the fundamental principles of all sound religion, and I regard them as you do in whatever sect I meet with them.
"As to Jesus of Nazareth, my opinion of whom you particularly desire, I think the system of Morals and his Religion, as he left them to us, the best the World ever saw or is likely to see; but I apprehend it has received various corrupt changes, and I have, with most of the present Dissenters in England, some doubts as to his divinity; though it is a question I do not dogmatize upon, having never studied it, and think it needless to busy myself with it, when I expect soon an opportunity of knowing the Truth with less trouble. I see no harm, however, in its being believed, if that belief has the good consequence, as probably it has, of making his doctrines more respected and better observed; especially as I do not perceive that the Supreme takes it amiss, by distinguishing the unbelievers in His government of the world with any particular marks of His displeasure."
I have no doubt that he was sincere, but it is possible to be sincere and still not be completely correct.

Someday, we'll find out who was right.

:)

Longtimetrekker1

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 9471

Report this Jul. 27 2009, 12:45 pm

> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (Longtimetrekker1 @ July 27 2009, 9:32 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (akebono62 @ July 27 2009, 12:27 pm)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (Longtimetrekker1 @ July 27 2009, 9:18 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 12:15 pm)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (Alisium @ July 27 2009, 12:14 pm)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 4:08 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (akebono62 @ July 27 2009, 11:47 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (WilburWood @ July 27 2009, 8:39 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (loveroftrekmen @ July 27 2009, 4:25 am)> id="QUOTE"> border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (PointFiveVulcan @ July 26 2009, 12:59 am)> id="QUOTE">The other founders besides Thomas Jefferson did found this nation with God in mind.

You are still free to believe what you want but its a Christian founded nation.
border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (akebono62 @ July 27 2009, 12:37 pm)

Absolutely untrue. We have discussed this on another thread or maybe this one, but history shows this nation was not founded on Christianity. In fact, the phrase was added much later. Nice try, but your wrong.
:D
I do not find in orthodox Christianity one redeeming feature.
Thomas Jefferson ?


Jefferson was a bit of a syncretist- partly from being so well-read.

:)
Benjamin Franklin believed in God, but not in the divinity of Jesus. ?I think his mellow, easy going view on religion is actually pretty interesting. ?Most people just don't know what the founding fathers thought about religion. ? They take public statements to represent private beliefs, even though they were politicians and knew the difference between public and private positions. ? Anyway, Ben is quite honest here I think:

"You desire to know something of my religion. It is the first time I have been questioned upon it. But I cannot take your curiosity amiss, and shall endeavour in a few words to gratify it. Here is my creed. I believe in one God, Creator of the Universe. That He governs it by His providence. That He ought to be worshipped. That the most acceptable service we render Him is doing good to His other children. That the soul of man is immortal, and will be treated with justice in another life respecting its conduct in this. These I take to be the fundamental principles of all sound religion, and I regard them as you do in whatever sect I meet with them.
"As to Jesus of Nazareth, my opinion of whom you particularly desire, I think the system of Morals and his Religion, as he left them to us, the best the World ever saw or is likely to see; but I apprehend it has received various corrupt changes, and I have, with most of the present Dissenters in England, some doubts as to his divinity; though it is a question I do not dogmatize upon, having never studied it, and think it needless to busy myself with it, when I expect soon an opportunity of knowing the Truth with less trouble. I see no harm, however, in its being believed, if that belief has the good consequence, as probably it has, of making his doctrines more respected and better observed; especially as I do not perceive that the Supreme takes it amiss, by distinguishing the unbelievers in His government of the world with any particular marks of His displeasure."
I have no doubt that he was sincere, but it is possible to be sincere and still not be completely correct.

Someday, we'll find out who was right.

:)
And that's exactly what he said, that he was certain he'd be finding out the answer shortly.

These were intelligent men with complex views that don't fit neatly into them being traditional Christians.  In the end, their personal statements aren't even relevant as only the Constitution they created dictates the role of government and religion.

natenemo

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 2658

Report this Jul. 28 2009, 12:54 am

puppets on strings...don't know anything.

loveroftrekmen

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 5864

Report this Jul. 28 2009, 2:15 am

Quote (natenemo @ July 27 2009, 1:54 am)
puppets on strings...don't know anything.

I think it is very rude of you to attack Christians and religious folk by calling them puppets.  Although that is an oft used metpahor for religious people, I think it is rude.  So is the religious sheep being lead by a fool.  I think you should have more respect for people that may not have rhyme nor reason behind their actions just because you don't understand their faith.

Kornula

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 1676

Report this Jul. 29 2010, 1:47 pm

The pledge of Allegiance and "in god we trust" were 20th century tag ons. I am not fond of living in a borderline theocracy, nor do I intend to

Dump "in god we trust" asap

Kornula

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 1676

Report this Jul. 29 2010, 1:49 pm

Quote: Kornula @ Jul. 29 2010, 1:47 pm

>The pledge of Allegiance and "in god we trust" were 20th century tag ons. I am not fond of living in a borderline theocracy, nor do I intend to see America become one.  to Dump "in god we trust" asap

Forum Permissions

You cannot post new topics in this forum

You cannot reply to topics in this forum

You cannot delete posts in this forum