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Slipstream?

> id="QUOTE">there is no need to recalibrate the warp scale since there are already in story explanations.

just because the scale goes to infinity at warp 10 (an asymptote), doesn't mean there is nothing on the other side of the asymptote. if you ever look at a tangent function there is an asymptote at pi/2 that goes off to infinity. does this mean the function is undefined after pi/2? NO. the function cycles every pi radians.

the warp scale and transwarp is the same way. it goes off to infinity at the warp 10 asymptote (which they have named the TRANSWARP THRESHOLD). the scale then continues on the other side of threshold with higher velocities and warp values that are greater than 10.

for some reason people think that just because the scale goes to infinity at 10 there is nothing beyond it. of course, as i've stated earlier, you can't just accelerate past the transwarp threshold. you need a different kind of drive to start on the other side of warp 10.

if you don't believe that explanation, here's a less mathematical one. just look at the definition of threshold from the American Heritage Dictionary:
:)

EnterpriseD713

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Report this Dec. 23 2005, 2:32 pm

I remember watching Voyager one time (i forgot the episode, i dont really watch Voyager, just when I can) and they ran into the Slipstream technology and it was faster than warp.

How did this work, and why didnt they use it for the whole way home?

Tannagra

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Report this Dec. 23 2005, 2:42 pm

As i remember it was very temperamental.

Though one Voyager episode tends to merge into every other one and i cant remember where or who they got it off.

Sisko38

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Report this Dec. 23 2005, 2:51 pm

U see my Friend, Slipstream is a highly unstable warp propulsion technology. It works by routing the energy from the Quantom drive through the deflector emitters to create a slipstream through subspace. However The crew of Voyager found that instability caused the drive to be unsafe.


They got it off an alien named Arturis who made his ship look like a federation ship so he could give the crew of Voyager to the Borg.

AquamonkeyEG

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Report this Dec. 23 2005, 3:29 pm

slipstream was in 2 VOY episodes. "Hope and Fear" and "Timeless"

the Hope and Fear slipstream drive was a lot slower but produced a lot of quantum stress on the hull so they could only use it for a short time.

the Timeless slipstream drive was a heck of a lot faster.

both slipstream drives work pretty much the same as borg transwarp. they generate a high velocity tunnel through supspace. any ship within the tunnel is pushed long at transwarp velocites (above warp 10).

the problem in Timeless was that there was a phase variance in the slipstream threshold. when the variance became too large it destabilized the slipstream and violently threw Voyager into normal space. with inertial dampeners offline they weren't able to stop or change course. they then crashed on a planet.

Tannagra

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Report this Dec. 23 2005, 4:07 pm

Quote (AquamonkeyEG @ Dec. 23 2005, 12:29 pm)
slipstream was in 2 VOY episodes. "Hope and Fear" and "Timeless"

the Hope and Fear slipstream drive was a lot slower but produced a lot of quantum stress on the hull so they could only use it for a short time.

the Timeless slipstream drive was a heck of a lot faster.

both slipstream drives work pretty much the same as borg transwarp. they generate a high velocity tunnel through supspace. any ship within the tunnel is pushed long at transwarp velocites (above warp 10).

the problem in Timeless was that there was a phase variance in the slipstream threshold. when the variance became too large it destabilized the slipstream and violently threw Voyager into normal space. with inertial dampeners offline they weren't able to stop or change course. they then crashed on a planet.

Aqua...i have to correct you there.

It it more likely somewhere around warp 9.99999. It cant be warp 10 as that would require an infinite amount of power and the ship would be everywhere at once.

Even in slipstream it still took some time,quite a few minutes, to travel.

AquamonkeyEG

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Report this Dec. 23 2005, 4:10 pm

Quote (Tannagra @ Dec. 23 2005, 4:07 pm)
Quote (AquamonkeyEG @ Dec. 23 2005, 12:29 pm)
slipstream was in 2 VOY episodes. "Hope and Fear" and "Timeless"

the Hope and Fear slipstream drive was a lot slower but produced a lot of quantum stress on the hull so they could only use it for a short time.

the Timeless slipstream drive was a heck of a lot faster.

both slipstream drives work pretty much the same as borg transwarp. they generate a high velocity tunnel through supspace. any ship within the tunnel is pushed long at transwarp velocites (above warp 10).

the problem in Timeless was that there was a phase variance in the slipstream threshold. when the variance became too large it destabilized the slipstream and violently threw Voyager into normal space. with inertial dampeners offline they weren't able to stop or change course. they then crashed on a planet.

Aqua...i have to correct you there.

It it more likely somewhere around warp 9.99999. It cant be warp 10 as that would require an infinite amount of power and the ship would be everywhere at once.

Even in slipstream it still took some time,quite a few minutes, to travel.

ALL transwarp is higher than warp 10...

Quote
2. An entrance or a doorway. 3. The place or point of beginning; the outset. 4. A point separating conditions that will produce a given effect from conditions of a higher or lower degree that will not produce the effect, as the intensity below which a stimulus is of sufficient strength to produce sensation or elicit a response: a low threshold of pain.

since they called it a "Transwarp Threshold" and using the definition above, it is quite obvious that transwarp is anything above warp 10, and not something with a lot of decimals in it (as that would be below the threshold and not in the domain of transwarp).


EDIT: If that doesn't do it for you, God help me because I must be in hell.

from another thread.

Tannagra

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Report this Dec. 23 2005, 4:13 pm

Transwarp is still a factor of warp..

The Startrek writers cant have their cake and eat it.

You cant have the delta flyer going Warp 10 and being everywhere at once.

Then say transwarp still takes time to travel but is faster..

Either one or the other.. not both.

nilasae

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Report this Dec. 23 2005, 4:56 pm

slipstream is a different type of faster than impulse travel from what i got. transworp is also different as well.

hard to compare in some aspects.

Vol_

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Report this Dec. 23 2005, 5:14 pm

Someone once told me that there are 4 types of transwarp .
1. The kind in "Threshold" being everywhere at once

2. Quantom slipstream drive

3. Borg version

and i cant remember the fourth . Transwarp basically means faster than warp .

AquamonkeyEG

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Report this Dec. 23 2005, 6:00 pm

Quote (Major_Vol @ Dec. 23 2005, 5:14 pm)
Someone once told me that there are 4 types of transwarp .
1. The kind in "Threshold" being everywhere at once

2. Quantom slipstream drive

3. Borg version

and i cant remember the fourth . Transwarp basically means faster than warp .

the Voth had a transwarp drive that has the same visual fx as normal warp bu slightly different.

transwarp is anything higher than warp 10 like i've said b4. just because 10 is an asymptote doesn't mean there is nothing higher than it like warp 11 or 13 which would be transwarp.

EnterpriseD713

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Report this Dec. 23 2005, 8:15 pm

I remember at the end of TNG where Riker was Captain of the enterprise. he ordered to get some place at Warp 13. (in the future)

Tannagra

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Report this Dec. 24 2005, 4:48 am

Quote (AquamonkeyEG @ Dec. 23 2005, 3:00 pm)
Quote (Major_Vol @ Dec. 23 2005, 5:14 pm)
Someone once told me that there are 4 types of transwarp .
1. The kind in "Threshold" being everywhere at once

2. Quantom slipstream drive

3. Borg version

and i cant remember the fourth . Transwarp basically means faster than warp .

the Voth had a transwarp drive that has the same visual fx as normal warp bu slightly different.

transwarp is anything higher than warp 10 like i've said b4. just because 10 is an asymptote doesn't mean there is nothing higher than it like warp 11 or 13 which would be transwarp.

Aqua

If your on about TNG warp 10...that is the maximum speed you can go..even Q cant go past Warp 10

Now..if your on about Kirks warp 10 your absolutely right as this is a standard warp speed. The Enterprise NCC-1701 refit was able to Warp 12 max emergency speed.

But with regard to TNG time period  warp 10 is max.period..

Tannagra

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Report this Dec. 24 2005, 4:52 am

Quote (EnterpriseD713 @ Dec. 23 2005, 5:15 pm)
I remember at the end of TNG where Riker was Captain of the enterprise. he ordered to get some place at Warp 13. (in the future)

For some reason, best known to the writers, they recalibrated the warp scale back to the original one used in Kirks time.

Whether it was actually the same is open to debate but it certainly wasnt the TNG scale, so no warp 13 isnt above the TNG series warp 10 sorry.

Warp 13 in 'All good things' if the same as the Kirk warp 13 would be 2197c or about Warp 9.65 ish.

Hope that helps

AquamonkeyEG

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Report this Dec. 24 2005, 11:37 am

there is no need to recalibrate the warp scale since there are already in story explanations.

just because the scale goes to infinity at warp 10 (an asymptote), doesn't mean there is nothing on the other side of the asymptote. if you ever look at a tangent function there is an asymptote at pi/2 that goes off to infinity. does this mean the function is undefined after pi/2? NO. the function cycles every pi radians.

the warp scale and transwarp is the same way. it goes off to infinity at the warp 10 asymptote (which they have named the TRANSWARP THRESHOLD). the scale then continues on the other side of threshold with higher velocities and warp values that are greater than 10.

for some reason people think that just because the scale goes to infinity at 10 there is nothing beyond it. of course, as i've stated earlier, you can't just accelerate past the transwarp threshold. you need a different kind of drive to start on the other side of warp 10.

if you don't believe that explanation, here's a less mathematical one. just look at the definition of threshold from the American Heritage Dictionary:
Quote
2. An entrance or a doorway. 3. The place or point of beginning; the outset. 4. A point separating conditions that will produce a given effect from conditions of a higher or lower degree that will not produce the effect, as the intensity below which a stimulus is of sufficient strength to produce sensation or elicit a response: a low threshold of pain.

since they called it a "Transwarp Threshold" and using the definition above, it is quite obvious that transwarp is anything above warp 10, and not something with a lot of decimals in it (as that would be below the threshold and not in the domain of transwarp).

Tannagra

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Report this Dec. 24 2005, 11:40 am

border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0">>>Quote (AquamonkeyEG @ Dec. 24 2005, 8:37 am)

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