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Why I just quit World of WarCraft

HoratioHornblower

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POSTS: 530

Report this May. 28 2005, 7:09 am

I just cancelled my account for WoW, and ya know---its kind of the same reason that I quit SW: Galaxies:

Those MMO's are NOT for a casual gamer!! There is absolutely NO way to contribute or to even compete with the people in those games that play it 8-12 hours a day, 6-7 days a week! Just NO way....no matter what you do as a casual gamer, those games are totally designed to reward TIME PLAYED.

Im sick of that paradigm---do most of the Dev's of those games think that EVERY GAMER is in that small niche of people who have the time to play games that often?!?

It was bad enough that those games were already very monotonous alot of the time, but since I am a player who only has time to put in about 10-15 hours a week playing, there just is no point in my spending money trying to play a game like that. Granted, there are things you can do in the game "at your own pace, do your own thing" etc, but face it: If you are someone who doesnt have the time (or the desire, for that matter) to play it ALOT, those kind of games will eventually leave you on your own, and severely lacking in key areas of gameplay.

I am just praying that ST:O will live up to the claims that they have stated---that there will be FUN gameplay to be had by players who are just "weekenders."

What scares me, is that WoW & SWG made the same claim---yet their games are perfect examples of a gamesystem that just rewards you for having NO life outside the game. If they really want to expand beyond the current MMO niche players, they have to just do two things:

1) Dont: make this game yet another MMO that is designed for Hardcore players, and leaving part-timers in the dust. If its going to boil down to rewarding TIME played, then youre cutting out ALOT of players, just like current MMOs have done.

2) Do: make this game  something beyond the current system of "Deliver This/Destroy That" mission/quest setups that make up the "grind" so many players dislike (as discussed in the Making Exploration A Central Theme thread). Grinding is not only the boring mainstay of current MMO's, but also is just another facet that contributes to Hardcore/No Life players having 99% of the FUN.......

JazH

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POSTS: 1849

Report this May. 28 2005, 8:24 am

You can't stop people from going on the game 20 hrs a week. The devs can try anything, but there is no solution to it. And frankly, it takes alot of time to develop the characters...and some people choose and have the time to do so.

Keogh

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POSTS: 602

Report this May. 28 2005, 8:28 am

I agree with your sentiment. Unfortunately, they've already indicated that players will develop and grow by completing missions where by they will eventually advance in rank and physically age. All of these things imply that the system will require time spent in the game in order to advance.

The only MMO that I've played that didn't feel so much like it required huge amounts of time to have fun was Planetside, but that's a FPS, and it became boring as well.

Jonnoo

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POSTS: 66

Report this May. 28 2005, 9:31 am

wow, i hate people who play non stop, theres this kid in my business class (grade 10) and everyday he plays the same game for 1 hour and a half... runescape its crazy i played it for like a day and wow soo bad, that kid needs a life

JazH

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POSTS: 1849

Report this May. 28 2005, 9:33 am

Quote (Jonnoo @ May 27 2005, 2:31 pm)
wow, i hate people who play non stop, theres this kid in my business class (grade 10) and everyday he plays the same game for 1 hour and a half... runescape its crazy i played it for like a day and wow soo bad, that kid needs a life

I used to play SWG for 3hrs a day monday to friday, and then about 5 hours on sat and sunday :/

Ellessar

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POSTS: 1848

Report this May. 28 2005, 10:53 am

I'm sorry Horatio, but I can't agree.  While I think endless grinding does not belong in any game, I do think that players should be rewarded for extra time spent in the game.

If someone plays for 5 hours a day and you only play 5 hours a week, then it is hardly fair to think you and he should be equal.

Aiten

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POSTS: 1040

Report this May. 28 2005, 3:06 pm

Im generally one of those who plays between 2-4 hours a day depending on how busy I am, and whether I am out in the evening.

I do, admit to having 12hour session a few times, but its nice to comepletely lose yourself if your not busy.

HailTrickster

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POSTS: 788

Report this May. 28 2005, 3:32 pm

This is a very, very good point.

Considering how many games there are to play and that people have more than one installed MMORPG's need the ability for people to just jump into and play them. May be just a quick skirmish or battle mission. I am not familiar with the in's and out's but this will be one of the major factors in the success or failure of Online because at the moment many of the Star Trek Gaming community are playing those sorts of missions - skirmishes or quick battles. Something which doesn't require you to build your character or whatever up before you can seriously compete with other people.

By the time Online is out I will probably be playing BF2 and the other Star Trek games that have been hinted about. I will probably give Online a go but I don't have a massive amount of time to spend to enjoy a game online. I hope to be able to play may be 3+ hours a week? May be more if Online is good, which I hope it will be.

ScottMG

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POSTS: 59

Report this May. 28 2005, 4:16 pm

Quote (Ellessar @ May 28 2005, 3:53 pm)
If someone plays for 5 hours a day and you only play 5 hours a week, then it is hardly fair to think you and he should be equal.

Why? Both are paying the same money after all.
Just because you play more shouldn't mean you become a higher level with more power, it should simply mean that you are spending more time doing something you enjoy.

Apotheosis

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POSTS: 33

Report this May. 28 2005, 4:54 pm

Oh where do I start with this post ...

I'm sorry but your logic is flawed, ALL MMOs are built on play time thats not going to change. If you can only play for one hour a week then here is a reality smack for you, MMO are NOT the genre for you. Stop trying to dumb down the genre because you're busy, there are so many other genre of games out there that are just as fun and rewarding that you can play with your limited time.

That would be like me playing a First person shooter and saying "I don't want to fight I just want to gather resources" and come complaining to a message board. No I don't do that, i go find another genre to fit my "needs".

Then you mention WoW and Star Wars Galaxies, to of the most dumbed down casual player friendly MMO's to date. yet they weren't casual enough for you? what more do you want? to log in and let the computer play the game for you?

I have been on both sides of the fence, when i first started playing MMO's I was able to play 8-10 hours a day, by most standards your typical "powergamer". As my life started to get more and more hectic I had to cut down where i was only able to play an hour or 2 of games a day. Notice I say "of games" not MMO, because in my infinite wisdom I knew I would not be able to compete. So you know what I did? I started playing FPS's Instead. A game where i can jump in play a few rounds have some fun and then log out. now since my life has become less hectic, I can play again 4-5 hours a night without a problem.


ScottMG wrote:
Quote
Why? Both are paying the same money after all.
Just because you play more shouldn't mean you become a higher level with more power, it should simply mean that you are spending more time doing something you enjoy.


Actually yes he should, what does money have to do with anything? the person chooses to play more instead of you. That would be like me working out for 3 hours a week and then whining "why don't I have a body like the guy that works out 3 hours a day".

Ortus_Sapienta

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POSTS: 1468

Report this May. 28 2005, 5:51 pm

Quote (ScottMG @ May 28 2005, 4:16 pm)
Quote (Ellessar @ May 28 2005, 3:53 pm)
If someone plays for 5 hours a day and you only play 5 hours a week, then it is hardly fair to think you and he should be equal.

Why? Both are paying the same money after all.
Just because you play more shouldn't mean you become a higher level with more power, it should simply mean that you are spending more time doing something you enjoy.

You are not paying for your levels. You are paying for monthly access. How you treat that access, playing every night for 4 hours or once a week for 2 hours is your choice. Levelling will occur if you meet the requirements and garner the xp.

If I pay my fee, I can game as I please and level at a rate that I choose (level grind notwithstanding). There should be no constraints on me, just because someone else fell behind.

~Ortus

HailTrickster

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 788

Report this May. 28 2005, 8:20 pm

My understanding of MMORPG's is that you have to build upon your character/profile to enjoy the game and truely participate. When I first login I am not asking to suddenly gain what another player has acheived by putting in more hours. I just wan't to enjoy the game the same as that player which is what the goal of the game is. If I spend 2 hours a week I should still get entertainment out of the game and my money's worth. If your saying that I need to spend over 5 hours for that then they should charge by the hour.

Not everyone has that amount of time to play games and Online will be competing with a lot of other MMORPG's and also other Star Trek games. If that is the way MMORPG's work then it will be loosing out on some players if you have to put in so much time.

If my understanding of MMORPG's/MMOG's is wrong then I apologise. I am just emphasising the point that HoratioHornblower made.

HoratioHornblower

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POSTS: 530

Report this May. 28 2005, 9:38 pm

Apotheosis your logic is part of the problem---youre saying that MMOs are ONLY for people who play 8-10 hours a day and if you cant play that much you shouldnt play at all....

BS!!

There is no reason on this planet (or any other :p) why someone who plays 10-20 hours a WEEK shouldnt be able to compete!! I mean come on---20 hours a week is like a freaking part time job for Gods sake---if thats STILL not good enough to be able to contribute/compete in the game, then there is a serious problem with peoples mindset. Thats the same narrow view which keeps MMO's to a "niche" and a good amount of ppl who buy the game are disappointed and dont play past the first or second month.....b/c theyre making them demand TOO MUCH TIME. How can it be so hard to make the game viable for both casual and power/no life gamer at the same time??

Hmm....I play as much as a part time job but STILL cant come close to those who wont do anything else but play the game, and yet the Devs continue to reward them for it...why am I gonna pay for this anymore? I am going to pay for a game that is gonna require me to play 40 hours a week+ to contribute? I think not.

HoratioHornblower

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POSTS: 530

Report this May. 28 2005, 9:51 pm

Problem is that the way it works now, if a person doesnt put in 8-10 hours a day then they dont deserve to have FUN. WTH? How many ppl (normal people) have that kind of time to play the game? IF the game is made with just those kind of people in mind, theyll have nothing to differentiate themselves other than Trek itself, theyre going to be competing with all of the current MMO's for that niche of TIME gamers, and will have to rely soley on the Trek franchise as their only unique selling point----they can appeal to more players by making it more fun for the part-timers! Make the game fun for people who can only play 10-20 hours a week, that is something that would really give them an extra appeal....if it can still be FUN by playing casually. Guild Wars & PlanetSide at least made some ground in that regard, and the main problem with PlanetSide wasnt the gametype---it was that they stopped adding content fairly early in the game.

In WoW and SWG the most fun parts of the game are highly dependent on your character skills---so naturally TIME/powergamers have more options when it comes to fun. The more you play those games, the less there is for a casual player to even be able to play the game with you and still be able to have fun playing it cooperatively. ST:O has 2+ more years b/f launch, if they cant look to games like PlanetSide & Guild Wars as at least a Start for closing the gap b/t TIME gamers and casual gamers, then casual players wont be renewing their subscriptions once they realize how much of a gap there is between them and the Timegamers; and will quit after they see all that theyre missing out on simply because they dont have that kind of time for games.

One thing that might help I think, is that by really making Exploration something fun for ALL types of gamers, it would keep the game interesting and Viable for people who dont have alot of time to play. If someone could pick up where they left off in exploring a new area (even if its Instanced)---and it had ramifications for other players(First Contacts, New Planets, Unique Resources, think of more!)---this would go a Long way towards making the casual player feel useful....not to mention take the game beyond the quest-based repetition of "Deliver This/Destroy That" which loses its FUN factor after relatively short time.

Exploration IS a central theme in the Star Trek universe, and its no jump in logic to say that it could address those 2 big problems that are also in MMO's today:

1)The Fun gap between casual players & hardcore players

2)The "grind" and repetition in current generation MMO's.

Exploration goes hand in hand with Star Trek, so if it is developed correctly and becomes a robust subsystem within the game, it can even be used to take this next-gen MMO to the next level of fun for ALL gamers!

ERoy

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POSTS: 1

Report this May. 29 2005, 12:25 am

Quote
Make the game fun for people who can only play 10-20 hours a week, that is something that would really give them an extra appeal


I think the problem I have with your statement is that I'm not sure I know what your version of "fun" is.  

If what you mean by fun is the ability to be fully competative with people who play the game more, than you have no point.  In a game that has rank and experience points/levels, than one must admit that the person that DOES more, GETS more.  You can't punish the hardcore players because they play more.  Much like in ANY roleplaying game, the hours you put in advances the story and levels you up.  

Money has nothing to do with it.  As someone earlier aptly put it, you're paying for access, not time spent.  If you CHOOSE not to play the game as much as someone else, that's not the developers fault, nor the hardcore gamers.

Just because you're, say, Level 4 and someone else is Level 50 doesn't mean you can't have fun.  You can still do everything all the other people in the appropriate level can do.

So my question would be -- what do you mean "have fun"?

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