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Creation Science question

human_of_the_plains

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 81

Report this Oct. 18 2004, 1:49 am

God is not limited by anthing, with the exception that he cannot commit a sin. You are right, God is so much more than was wrote down in the Bible. The human mind is incapable (as in it is impossible) of wrapping itself around the idea of God.

Then, just to really blow your mind he became human (Jesus Christ) at the same time he was God. And he is the Holy Spirit all the while. Therefore, God is three things all at once, but at the same time those three are all one. It doesn't make since according to any human logic; it takes faith to accept it, which is hard for engineers like myself to do.

human_of_the_plains

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POSTS: 81

Report this Oct. 18 2004, 1:58 am

I think we are on the same page, just looking at a different part of it.  What we are saying agrees with each other, it is just a different perspective of the same thing.

P.S. I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one who believes in God.

lanceromega

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POSTS: 3859

Report this Oct. 18 2004, 5:05 am

Quote (human_of_the_plains @ Oct. 17 2004, 10:58 pm)
I think we are on the same page, just looking at a different part of it.  What we are saying agrees with each other, it is just a different perspective of the same thing.

P.S. I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one who believes in God.

the problem believing in god and him be a reality are two seperate things. Also it does not really tell you the nature of such a being.

The Anicent Greeks believe in many gods, but as Plato said, "if one is to search for virture donot look to the Gods", for their gods were simply human like figures with supernatural power.

Even today we have many reglions, each with their own take on the creator/creators, but all of this really miss the point,
which is the So call science of Creationalism. While it nice to have faith it is improper to attempt to pawn it off as science.

Science is a search for the truth, any scientist will tell you that it not an all embracing paradyme to live life by, but a method to come up with models of physical (note not metaphysical) reality that allow us to manipulate it.

The success of theory of evolution is that it embraces other theories of biology and genetics. These theories have lead to major breakthru in medicines and understanding of Genetic diseases. What we do with the Knowledge ( whether we do ill or good) falls under the realms of moral conscience ( and what ever belief we embrace)....

The same goes for the Astrophysical theories. Einstein relativity ( which seem to offend so many of the creationalist) has spawn so many discoveries that it success defies even its creator imagination.

Science demand proof, which can be repeated in the lab and can be seen on regular bases in the universe around us. Any theory that cannot make predictions that can tested is not deem scientific ( One of the reason why String theory is heart breaking, cause it unprovable at our basic level of technology).

It sadden me that so many good christians feel so threaten by science that they have to go to such extreme to discredit it. Many of the scientist I have met are men of deep and powerful faith. Many see it as their duty to explore the universe and show the working of the creator and his nature.

Creationalist try to fit reality to match the bible, if Science proves them wrong on a point they then attempt to rationalize a way that the theory is wrong. This has lead to attacks on:

- radioactive dating, which is base on radioactive decay. I work with the same Formula and I see there proof every day.

- Or to attack Relativity, which has survived every attack against it and has been proven is host of ever precise experiments.

The list of theories and fields of sciences that clash with the Creationalist is long. I just wish that for the good of regilion that they stop slamming into the same dead end. IT not good for mankind spiritual or mental development. Blind faith is harmful, just look at the Holy war being conducted these day by elements of islam against the western world.

One day it will cause the ultimate proof of these scientific theories to be used, and I hate to see a mushroom cloud covering any part of the world, east, middle east or west, or some super plaque wiping out mandkind.

El_Flesho

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POSTS: 3

Report this Oct. 18 2004, 9:52 pm

What is the matter with all you people with your 'god this' and 'god that'?
Since when does 'god' come into anyone's life aside from being made up? people think they feel him for sure inside of them, yet there is never, ever any shred of proof. How can these people be interested in a show that is grounded so firmly in science?
Science is the absolute antithesis of religion. People who investigate using the tools of science, yet still have a deep feeling of faith are deliberately closing off some part of their minds! They deliberately turn blind eyes to what the data tells them. I find such people utterly foolish despite what technical brilliance they may have.

None of the universe we see needs any god to invent it. It is simply adding an unneccessary step into the question, as Carl Sagan so eloquently put it.

I would be overjoyed to have some god appear and take humanity by the hand, and say to us that there's really no need to worry; we will persist after death. But I have no problem accepting the truth: when you're gone, you're GONE. It doesn't keep me up nights with worry. It doesn't make me a greedy selfish S.O.B. who cares for nobody other than myself. It makes everyone and every moment all the more precious, because they are finite. I don't need some fantasy to curl up into a ball in the corner with.

It seems to me very much that the 'Star Trek' universe really has no place for religion, despite the idea of 'IDIC'. Everyone may be entitled to their opinion, but man, it gets tiresome when I hear religion spouted. I had hoped that 'Star Trek' would attract intellectuals. I should look elsewhere for discussions that are grounded in reality instead of utter fantasy.

Giantevilhead

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POSTS: 1175

Report this Oct. 18 2004, 11:08 pm

Quote (human_of_the_plains @ Oct. 17 2004, 10:27 pm)
If you don't believe in God (Allah, Buddah, Guia, etc...), then I honestly feel sorry for you, because you have no hope.  And what is life worth without hope?

Buddha isn't a god. Buddhism isn't about worshipping any god, it's about transcendence. Buddha isnt a single person or being. Buddha is a type of person who has awakened to the true nature of existence, whose insight allows them to achieve a state of deathless peace and allows them to help others achieve the same level of enlightenment. A person can be both an Atheist and a Buddhist since Atheism is the disbelief in the existence of a god or gods and Buddhism does not conflict with that belief. Buddhism is actually one of the few religions that can be logically justified and does not use fallacious arguments.

lanceromega

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POSTS: 3859

Report this Oct. 19 2004, 5:10 am

Quote (Giantevilhead @ Oct. 18 2004, 8:08 pm)
Quote (human_of_the_plains @ Oct. 17 2004, 10:27 pm)
If you don't believe in God (Allah, Buddah, Guia, etc...), then I honestly feel sorry for you, because you have no hope. And what is life worth without hope?

Buddha isn't a god. Buddhism isn't about worshipping any god, it's about transcendence. Buddha isnt a single person or being. Buddha is a type of person who has awakened to the true nature of existence, whose insight allows them to achieve a state of deathless peace and allows them to help others achieve the same level of enlightenment. A person can be both an Atheist and a Buddhist since Atheism is the disbelief in the existence of a god or gods and Buddhism does not conflict with that belief.

Quote
Buddhism is actually one of the few religions that can be logically justified and does not use fallacious arguments.


How? and can you prove this?

human_of_the_plains

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 81

Report this Oct. 19 2004, 7:15 pm

OK. Before the glitch on ST.com's site, I had a decent sized post, but because I don't want to retype all of it, here's the Reader's Digest version.  

We will not all agree whether or not there is a God, it just ain't gonna happen.  And, I don't believe science can either prove or disprove God's existence; besides, that's not what it's purpose is, science is in place to show the why's and how's of His creation.

Giantevilhead

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POSTS: 1175

Report this Oct. 19 2004, 10:53 pm

Quote (lanceromega @ Oct. 19 2004, 2:10 am)
Quote (Giantevilhead @ Oct. 18 2004, 8:08 pm)
Quote (human_of_the_plains @ Oct. 17 2004, 10:27 pm)
If you don't believe in God (Allah, Buddah, Guia, etc...), then I honestly feel sorry for you, because you have no hope. And what is life worth without hope?

Buddha isn't a god. Buddhism isn't about worshipping any god, it's about transcendence. Buddha isnt a single person or being. Buddha is a type of person who has awakened to the true nature of existence, whose insight allows them to achieve a state of deathless peace and allows them to help others achieve the same level of enlightenment. A person can be both an Atheist and a Buddhist since Atheism is the disbelief in the existence of a god or gods and Buddhism does not conflict with that belief.

Quote
Buddhism is actually one of the few religions that can be logically justified and does not use fallacious arguments.


How? and can you prove this?

Buddhism teaches that religion should be logical, practical, and actually help people to achieve enlightenment. Buddhism is taught as more of a philosophy than a religion. Buddhism actually encourages skepticism and questioning of concepts and ideas and theory or belief is off limits.

lanceromega

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 3859

Report this Oct. 20 2004, 1:20 am

Quote (Giantevilhead @ Oct. 19 2004, 7:53 pm)
Quote (lanceromega @ Oct. 19 2004, 2:10 am)
Quote (Giantevilhead @ Oct. 18 2004, 8:08 pm)
Quote (human_of_the_plains @ Oct. 17 2004, 10:27 pm)
If you don't believe in God (Allah, Buddah, Guia, etc...), then I honestly feel sorry for you, because you have no hope.  And what is life worth without hope?

Buddha isn't a god. Buddhism isn't about worshipping any god, it's about transcendence. Buddha isnt a single person or being. Buddha is a type of person who has awakened to the true nature of existence, whose insight allows them to achieve a state of deathless peace and allows them to help others achieve the same level of enlightenment. A person can be both an Atheist and a Buddhist since Atheism is the disbelief in the existence of a god or gods and Buddhism does not conflict with that belief.

Quote
Buddhism is actually one of the few religions that can be logically justified and does not use fallacious arguments.


How? and can you prove this?

Buddhism teaches that religion should be logical, practical, and actually help people to achieve enlightenment. Buddhism is taught as more of a philosophy than a religion. Buddhism actually encourages skepticism and questioning of concepts and ideas and theory or belief is off limits.

but does this prove a logical justification that you claim or that it agruements are any less fallacious then any other religion...

Giantevilhead

GROUP: Members

POSTS: 1175

Report this Oct. 20 2004, 1:35 am

But the fact that Buddhism allows for questioning and argument of its concepts and ideas rather than just saying that people "should have faith" at least shows an acceptance of logic which other religions lack. Unfortunately, the only way I can prove to you that the arguments put forth Buddhism possess little or no logical fallacies is by showing you all the teachings of the religion and proving to you that they are all logically sound and that would take a very long time which I do not have. So regrettably, I can only refer you to some websites that has information about Buddhism and you may have to discern for yourself the soundness of Buddhist teachings. Heres a good one:

http://www.buddhistinformation.com/

Heres an article from that site describing the nature of Buddhism:

http://www.buddhistinformation.com/is_buddhism_a_religion1.htm

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